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Underbody braces, turbos and more!

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 12:14 pm 
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Location: Orlando, FL
So we picked up a 2000 Metro 1.0 5 speed, 135k miles, a short while ago and hoped that replacing the O2 sensors and tune-up would clear the lopey idle. Dummy me I should have done a compression test in the owners driveway. :x

- I did replace both front/rear O2 sensors, that cleared the CEL.
- New air filter, some oil on the bottom of air filter pan but previous owner said he replaced the pcv valve and yes it does look new.
- Cleaned out the EGR passages and new NGK spark plugs.

Ok, so I do the compression test. Brought the engine up to operating temp, let the cooling fan cycle once, pull the fuel pump fuse. Pulled all 3 spark plugs, disable the ignition coil. Here are the results:
dry 80, 110, 80
wet 180, 120, 105

My plan:
- new chrome plate faced piston rings and hone the piston cylinders
- maybe rod bearings
- 3tech stainless exhaust valves and head bolts, should I also replace the intake valves?
- new valve seals, 3tech bronze valve guides?
- standard head gasket? and enlarge the oil holes to match the cylinder head/block
- water pump
- timing belt

Am I on the right track?

On a side note, our driveway is only packed sand as is typical of Orlando. What can I lay down under the car to keep my jack and jack stands stable? I at least have a shed full of tools to work with and I'm not afraid of taking the motor apart. I did the sr20ve install in my G20 so this car should be a piece of cake. I may decide to drop off the cylinder head with a local shop for an easier time with it. The car does not overheat so I don't need a whole lot of work on it.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 12:26 pm 
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Location: Palm Springs: Too hot from June to Oct.!
oldman wrote:
On a side note, our driveway is only packed sand as is typical of Orlando. What can I lay down under the car to keep my jack and jack stands stable? I at least have a shed full of tools to work with and I'm not afraid of taking the motor apart. I did the sr20ve install in my G20 so this car should be a piece of cake. I may decide to drop off the cylinder head with a local shop for an easier time with it. The car does not overheat so I don't need a whole lot of work on it.

I don't know if you are on the right track, but whether it's packed sand or a little gravel, a block of wood can give you a leg up
Image
on safety.
Even if its a square of 3/4" OSB under a jackstand, these cars are light enough that you should be OK.
What did you use when you did the other car?

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DIY Shocks: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=45483
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Once you get the cars dialed-in (compression, leaks, bearings, alignment, brakes) swap in new rubber and glass, you've got something which should last for years!


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 2:17 pm 
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Location: Orlando, FL
I did the motor swap on the G20 back in Oregon, in a shop that I rented. I miss that shop. Had an engine crane and 240 volt power.

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'95 Geo Metro 3/5


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 11:39 am 
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Location: Orlando, FL
My air filter housing is missing this piece:
Image

as you can see here:
Image

Is this considered a vacuum leak? I'm trying to figure out why my idle drops so low after letting off the throttle. And, the motor runs rough, like it has a miss. I'm sure the low compression is mostly to blame for that. Or entirely to blame?

My timing is set correctly now. I have not messed with the idle speed screw.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 11:51 am 
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Location: Palm Springs: Too hot from June to Oct.!
oldman wrote:
My air filter housing is missing this piece:
Image

as you can see here:
Image

Is this considered a vacuum leak?

No
oldman wrote:
I'm trying to figure out why my idle drops so low after letting off the throttle. And, the motor runs rough, like it has a miss. I'm sure the low compression is mostly to blame for that. Or entirely to blame?

My timing is set correctly now. I have not messed with the idle speed screw.

Yes, your low compression is entirely to blame.
Until you change the rings,
Image
you are wasting time.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/85-00-GE ... ccessories

You might think in terms of getting other new engine parts while you are in there, unless you bought this to flip.

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DIY Broken Bolt Removal: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=41042
DIY Clutch Adjustment: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=48281
DIY Wheel Bearings: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=29003
DIY Shocks: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=45483
DIY Wheel Align: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=42479
Once you get the cars dialed-in (compression, leaks, bearings, alignment, brakes) swap in new rubber and glass, you've got something which should last for years!


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 12:04 pm 
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Location: Orlando, FL
Phil N Ed wrote:
..., unless you bought this to flip.


Oh not likely. My wife has work and school on the other side of Orlando, so lots of driving for her. This car will be for her to help save on gas.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 1:44 pm 
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Location: Palm Springs: Too hot from June to Oct.!
GeoMetroForum members seem to recommend PartsDinosaur.
On the West Coast, we have had good luck with CNS.
My Wife likes her little Metro, but she's an exception.
The money she saves on gas goes to women's suits at Macy's :wink: .
Are you sure your wife will be happy with it?
(What's she used to driving?)

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DIY Shocks: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=45483
DIY Wheel Align: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=42479
Once you get the cars dialed-in (compression, leaks, bearings, alignment, brakes) swap in new rubber and glass, you've got something which should last for years!


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 8:28 pm 
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Location: Orlando, FL
Oh yea, she's the one who suggested it. She says the Metro is a cute car. Lucky me. All she has driven in the past 5 years is B13 Sentra SE-R, NX2000 and G20. She never takes them to redline though, but I do. :twisted:

Never thought she would actually go for a Metro. She wants to save gas money to buy clothes also. I won't argue with that. I like them too, don't get me wrong. In fact, I'm waiting for an opportunity on a Swift GT.

I'll check out partsdinosaur, thanks.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:53 pm 
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PM that Suprfly guy, and get him to sell you a set of polished/oversized valves, bronze guides, and a hopped up cam. I finally sorted my car out, and the idle is just sexy sounding at around a 1000rpm... 2" shitty bend aluminized, running through a 2" highflow Magnaflow cat, a 2" x 4" x 18" Magnaflow resonator, and a 2" x 6" x 14" Magnaflow muffler.

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My cars:

J. McBean: '98 Suzuki Swift 1.3L 16v SOHC 5sp+ "Mk5" Made in Canada
The Mini Rattler: '94 Suzuki Swift .993L 6v SOHC 5sp+ "Mk3" Made in Canada *The Winter Beater*
B. Berry: '90 Chevrolet Turbo Sprint 1.0L 6v SOHC 5sp+ "Mk2" Made in Japan

I got 18MPG in a 3cyl with a 5 speed manual 4dr, '93 Metro! :yeahyeah


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2011 10:22 am 
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Location: Orlando, FL
If he is 3tech then yea I'm getting stuff from him soon. I get paid at the end of the month and then it's parts buying time! I would do all the performance stuff but I'm saving up for a turbo install on the sr20ve. Besides, my wife is the one who wants the economy cam. She wants to go for 50mpg on the highway.

A little vid of a turbo sr20ve:

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2011 11:10 am 
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ECO cam is no good in the heavy body MK4/MK5 and unless you plan on changing out the tranny, you'll be no where near it's power band.

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My cars:

J. McBean: '98 Suzuki Swift 1.3L 16v SOHC 5sp+ "Mk5" Made in Canada
The Mini Rattler: '94 Suzuki Swift .993L 6v SOHC 5sp+ "Mk3" Made in Canada *The Winter Beater*
B. Berry: '90 Chevrolet Turbo Sprint 1.0L 6v SOHC 5sp+ "Mk2" Made in Japan

I got 18MPG in a 3cyl with a 5 speed manual 4dr, '93 Metro! :yeahyeah


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2011 11:53 am 
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Location: Orlando, FL
Oh ok, I'll consider swapping out the tranny. The current one has a little trouble shifting down to 2nd anyways.

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:13 pm 
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oldman wrote:
Oh ok, I'll consider swapping out the tranny. The current one has a little trouble shifting down to 2nd anyways.


If you do, try and get one from a 4cyl from 95 to 01. 3.79:1 gearing and it's got the heavier internals.

Economy Cam is built to give good low end, not upper rpm power. As such the stock 4.39:1 tranny you've got will cruise at pretty high 3500 rpm at 65mph. So you'd be better off with a more performance oriented Cam, and as long as you don't go bonkers with it, it won't actually suffer worse mileage as long as she can keep her foot out of it. Also change that gear box oil over to a Syncromesh fluid, and the 2nd gear syncro issue should go away.

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My cars:

J. McBean: '98 Suzuki Swift 1.3L 16v SOHC 5sp+ "Mk5" Made in Canada
The Mini Rattler: '94 Suzuki Swift .993L 6v SOHC 5sp+ "Mk3" Made in Canada *The Winter Beater*
B. Berry: '90 Chevrolet Turbo Sprint 1.0L 6v SOHC 5sp+ "Mk2" Made in Japan

I got 18MPG in a 3cyl with a 5 speed manual 4dr, '93 Metro! :yeahyeah


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 10:44 am 
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Location: Orlando, FL
Phil N Ed wrote:
Until you change the rings,
Image
you are wasting time.


I just bought that set, they are on the way.

And I'm in contact with suprf1y about the head rebuild parts, head gasket and a +10 cam sprocket. Apart from all those items I'm buying a intake manifold gasket and exhaust manifold gasket. Then a bore hone kit and other misc supplies.

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'95 Geo Metro 3/5


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:51 pm 
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Location: Palm Springs: Too hot from June to Oct.!
oldman wrote:

My plan:

- rod bearings

:goodpost:
I have had good luck with those NPR rings so far, although Hastings is always a good way to go.
Don't leave home without the rod bearings.

And this thread is beginning to sound 'happy', not 'sad'.

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DIY Broken Bolt Removal: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=41042
DIY Clutch Adjustment: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=48281
DIY Wheel Bearings: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=29003
DIY Shocks: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=45483
DIY Wheel Align: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=42479
Once you get the cars dialed-in (compression, leaks, bearings, alignment, brakes) swap in new rubber and glass, you've got something which should last for years!


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2011 4:36 pm 
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Location: Orlando, FL
I see that Harbor Freight sells the following:

Image
Image
Image

Total cost about $35. Do I need the piston ring pliers? And I may have to file down the piston rings. Is there a recommended file for this job?

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 1:09 am 
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Location: Alberta, Canada
You won't need to file down the rings. If anything your gaps will be a bit on the high side, due to the usual slight wear on the bore these have when they are rebuilt without boring. This is nothing to worry about, you will land up with a very reliable little engine with a little extra piston to wall clearance. I use a more simple style of ring plier, but yes ideally you should use them, It makes the job easier and I have read that ring manufacture don't like it when rings are "spiralled" onto a piston, perhaps it distorts them to much? Don't know, and I'm sure its been done with successwith and without ring expander tool. For the price, I'd get one and use it. I have done tons and never had a ring seal issue, so I know using one works.
You won't fix your second gear issue with fluid, its worn synchros causing this. If you nudge the shifter towards first when downshifting into second you will find it shifts easier. Its a good way to prolong them once they are getting worn for as long as possible.
Stick with your 4.39 geared trans, any lower and it will be lugging and likely will not gain any mileage, other than on very long flat roads. Have seen a decrease in overall mileage switching to 4.1 in 95+ cars, the 3cyl just has a hard time pulling 5th gear in the heavier car with 13" tires.

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1995 Swift w/16V 4.39s, 3tech cam, Esteem t-body, Header, needs more.
1995 Gt Mustang "Boss Shinoda" package.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 9:13 am 
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Location: Orlando, FL
Thank you for that information.

I made some progress yesterday. I'm thinking of pulling the head with the intake manifold still installed. I can't reach those last two nuts on the bottom of the intake manifold. As for the head bolts, I have read it is 10mm or 11mm, 12 point. I have to see if one of my sockets is good enough for the job. The last thing I want is to round the heads on those bolts.
## Edit: I realized it's 10mm. I have a craftsman socket that fits very well. I'm gonna go for it.

Image
Image

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 11:53 am 
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Success !!

I made sure to spray those head bolts with Brake Cleaner. That helps the socket to "bite" the head bolt and turn it instead of rounding it.

Cylinder 1:
Image

Cylinder 2:
Image

Cylinder 3:
Image

And:
Image

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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2011 6:15 pm 
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where did that #1 valve seat go? :twisted:

time for a new head. :blackeye:

i bought a 10mm deep well 12 point impact socket just for unscrewing recalcitrant head bolts. works every time. :wink: it was a pita to find a single 12 point socket, though, but worth every penny of the $8 i spent on it.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2011 1:01 pm 
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t3 ragtop wrote:
where did that #1 valve seat go? :twisted:

time for a new head. :blackeye:


Really? I guess I'm not knowledgeable enough to recognize it.

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2011 6:00 pm 
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Ok, I'm understanding more with additional research I did this afternoon. Won't I be able to lap the new valves in place?

Some goodies arrived today via Mike (suprf1y).
Image

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2011 7:08 pm 
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i sucked your pic of the #1 cylinder into my computer and blew it up for a closer look.

what i originally took for bad valve seat erosion now appears to be some kind of "booger" and it's shadow instead of missing metal.

i don't know what that is. :lol:

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My Cardomain Page -Ol' Blue
My YouTube Channel
My Photo Gallery
SAAB Sonett II


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2011 9:51 pm 
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Oh good, I feel better now.

Will I need any special tools to remove/replace the valve guides?

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PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2011 10:01 pm 
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an arbor press is handy. the guides are pressed in.

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1991 Blue Geo Metro Convertible highly modified 1.0L Turbo3 5 spd. - 1991 Red Geo Metro Convertible customized with a Twincam 5 spd.

My Turbo3 Project
My Cardomain Page -Ol' Blue
My YouTube Channel
My Photo Gallery
SAAB Sonett II


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