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 Post subject: MAF seems slow to react
PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2008 12:23 am 
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Sad but True...

Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 8:20 pm
Posts: 2973
Location: Saskatchewan
Ok first off, I tore the whole maf apart to clean/lube everything, it was messy and I found some places where the maf was actually "dragging" so I figured everything was going to be better after I cleaned it.

But now (logging with lc-1) im seeing that as im stepping on the gas it goes lean (like 16-17afr) before it jumps down to a usable amount. This it didnt do before, but it seemed like it was sticking occasionally, and id drop all power and lose fuel (19+ afr) and the car would basically die.

It doesnt seem to be doing that anymore but it is having problems giving me fuel on light throttle, I pin it and it still goes, but the time before boost gets up there it goes dangerously lean, and ive been having to play with the maf all night to get it drivable (knew that when I took it all apart, but it seems something is wrong)

is there anything else I can do? im going to pull the whole thing apart again tomorrow, all I used for bearing lube was anti-sieze grease, probably not the best choice but I dont think its whats causing the slow reaction? It feels fine with my finger, but im not logging maf output voltage currently (to see if its sticking)

One thing I did notice was the bearings were kinda noisy and not very free moving... it felt like it stuck a little when I had the gate out of it, so I put a bunch of the grease in there and moved it all around, and the noise did go away, thus completing the project putting it all back together and now im stuck with a slow responsive maf.... or atleast thats what it seems

edit and as far as I know, the idle mixture on the maf hasnt been adjusted, it looked factory and the plug up top looks like its never been removed (as did the bottom cover when I tore it apart). and the spring tension and arm position are basically where they should be (have good afrs on boost).
it was easy to take it apart, and ive got pics too. but I wonder if the bearings inside it were just bad? can I replace them even?

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1991 Swift GT Build G10 +25 psi + other goodies
1996 Metro Build QR25de swap, still undecided where to take it
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PostPosted: Sun May 04, 2008 2:56 am 
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Sad but True...

Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 8:20 pm
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Location: Saskatchewan
posted this on my local carclub forum, instead of re-making the thread, heres some additional info.

"Maf needs bearings?"
Quote:
well technically its a vaf, a gate style maf, not just your typical hot wire kinda maf...

anyways, theres essentially 2 bearings inside this. Im not sure if its a joined dual sleeve kinda thing, or if its 2 separate bearings all together, they do spin by themselves though.

The problem I was having (or atleast decided this is what it had to be) was the gate was sticking, either sticking closed when im trying to boost (and not making power, going lean etc) or its sticking for a brief second before it opens up, like a slow response, so I go lean (17 or so afr) and then it catches up and is good again.

So I pulled it all apart, and it was pretty dirty, probably never been cleaned, so we got rid of all the crud and 1000grit sanded it smooth. it almost looked new again! But I couldnt do anything about the bearings but grease em up. And that lasted all of one night, because here I am at ten to two posting this, with the maf disassembled again, awaiting some guidance I suppose. please help?

the bearings:
Image
Image
Image

Image



but even half put back together with lubed bearings I can still feel some grittyness in the bearings, its less than it was before I pulled it apart, but def still there. And once I clip the gate back to the body of the maf (through bearings... and bearings essentially become "loaded") the grittyness is more obvious.

gate:
Image
Image

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1991 Swift GT Build G10 +25 psi + other goodies
1996 Metro Build QR25de swap, still undecided where to take it
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PostPosted: Mon May 05, 2008 3:30 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 8:20 pm
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Location: Saskatchewan
so yes it was bearings, you can feel they feel gritty when you try to turn them with your fingers, but turning the gate makes it almost undetectable. Tried it with jba's maf last night and it works great. So I ordered new bearings and cleaned up the whole maf, sanded 1000grit and itll be just as good as a new maf. That suzuki would charge 400 for.

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1996 Metro Build QR25de swap, still undecided where to take it
the lolcar family


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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 12:21 pm 
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Sad but True...

Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 8:20 pm
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Location: Saskatchewan
for what its worth, I had new bearings put in it. And its absolutely 100% better. Even if your maf isnt sticking I bet new bearings will liven things up.
Image
Image

bearing is made by NPN, and I walked into a bearing place and gave them the bearing number, which was W688AZZ, and I paid almost 30 bucks a piece! But the maf is essentially 100% refurbished now, and I was watchin the afrs on my laptop and its a hundred times better.

And for when YOU take your maf apart, you will come across THREE washers, 2 skinny ones and one roughly the size of both skinny ones. You want one skinny one on the maf gate male end as a spacer between the washer and the body of the maf, and then when you reinstall it you put the skinny one down before the spring on the upper half and the thick one on top. You want the thick one up top so you can push down on it. Its kinda tricky to get back together (or even apart for that matter) but youll know what I mean when you pull it off.

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1991 Swift GT Build G10 +25 psi + other goodies
1996 Metro Build QR25de swap, still undecided where to take it
the lolcar family


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PostPosted: Thu May 08, 2008 1:02 pm 
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a.k.a Bum head
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Location: London, ON
Those would be NTN bearings. ;)

Thanks for the writeup. This would be a good thread to sticky.


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PostPosted: Fri May 09, 2008 4:23 pm 
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Sad but True...

Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 8:20 pm
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Location: Saskatchewan
ntn, yes, sorry :oops:

might aswell throw a few more pics here, forgot I had one with the funny clip you will have to take out. putting it in takes more than 2 hands though. You can take it out after the cog wheel is out by just using a screw driver and prying. careful though, theres a washer above a hidden spring, and youll lose that washer if you dont cover the maf with your hand or be careful.

sanded with 1000grit after using a boatload of carb cleaner
Image
Image
then carb cleaner again!

only showing 2 of three washers here, one is thicker than other (hard to tell) there are 2 skinny ones though
Image

Image
you cant actually remove this piece, so you need to remove 3 screws holding it to the board and 4 screws holding the siliconed cover to body (silicon it back when you are done)

Image
hopefully you noted the position of the spring and the sweep arm beforehand

such a difference. wow


edit: oh and use grease in the bearings when you put it back together

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1991 Swift GT Build G10 +25 psi + other goodies
1996 Metro Build QR25de swap, still undecided where to take it
the lolcar family


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 12, 2009 11:17 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 03, 2006 9:34 pm
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Location: Willow River B.C.
How about making this a sticky??

Scott

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