TeamSwift

Home of the Suzuki mini-compacts ! Your Home for all things Suzuki Swift, Geo Metro, Holden Barina, Chevy Sprint, Pontiac Firefly, and Suzuki Cultus. TeamSwift is a technical performance oriented community!
It is currently Mon Oct 23, 2017 2:53 am

Underbody braces, turbos and more!

All times are UTC - 5 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 45 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 3:02 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2008 2:49 am
Posts: 10
Location: New Zealand
Hello
I have come across a g10a 3 cyl engine with the turbo but it is not efi . The engine was pulled out of the car by someone else and I have a cut loom and a box full of bits .

Image

Image

Can anyone point me in the right direction to get some info to help me get it up and running ?
The engine number is G10-149553 , can anyone date the engine from this ? It has a knock control box and a control module and a Vacuum switch unit that all need to be wired in . Then I need to start on the maze of air control valves and the associated manifold plumbing . Hope to get it sorted and put in into a suzuki LJ 4x4 .

Issues at the moment are wiring and also cam timing , I think its 90 deg out :( . Are these an interferance fit motor , might be pulling it apart earlier than planned .
If it all gets to hard maybe I put aftermarket efi on it .

Thanks

Chris


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 7:26 am 
Offline
a.k.a Bum head
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 31, 2004 5:29 pm
Posts: 3157
Location: London, ON
YAY! Something "new" in the turbo G10 world. Looks interesting... weird intake manifold, but interesting nonetheless.

More pictures required. ;)

The G10 is a non-interference engine. There shouldn't be any damage to the valves if the cam and crank disassociate. :D

There shouldn't be much to wire on this engine, since it's non-efi. Doesn't mean that there isn't still a whole pile of little things to take care of, though.

Hopefully someone from your side of the sea can help a bit more than we can, since we didn't see that engine in our cars.


Chris

_________________
Good stuff for sale!

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=42901&start=0


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 2:14 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2008 2:49 am
Posts: 10
Location: New Zealand
I will post some more pic's , once I get new batteries for the camera :( .
I can see lots of similarities to an efi one , the intake to the turbo is the same , the turbo housing is the same but where this has a rubber conection in the turbo output efi cars seem to have an intercooler .

Can anyone confirm how to time the cam on there g10 ? I expect with the crank at tdc the cam pully is at 12 oclock , inline with the mark on the rocker cover , this is how a g13 is timed so just my best guess . Pulling the rocker cover off to do it the hard way , well is just too hard at the moment .

If this is the way it is ment to be it is currently out but 1/4 cam rotation and hopefully explain why there is almost no compression .

Thanks

Chris


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Sep 03, 2008 2:55 pm 
Offline
Suzuki Elder
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2003 12:47 pm
Posts: 11669
Location: columbus, ohio
mudzuk wrote:
I think its 90 deg out :( .


just to mess with you :twisted: a 3 cylinder engine can never be 90 degrees out. :lol: the crank lobes are intrinsically separated by 120 degrees. even if the cam was 180 out, the valve timing would be 60 degrees off.

the g10 is a non-interference engine design. the cam timing should probably be set up just as listed for the mk1 and the rocker adustments should be the same.

that's a neat engine, non-intercooled, carbed, no doubt a JDM offering and new to me. thanks for the cool pic. :D

_________________
1991 Blue Geo Metro Convertible highly modified 1.0L Turbo3 5 spd. - 1991 Red Geo Metro Convertible customized with a Twincam 5 spd.

My Turbo3 Project
My Cardomain Page -Ol' Blue
My YouTube Channel
My Photo Gallery
SAAB Sonett II


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 12:21 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2008 2:49 am
Posts: 10
Location: New Zealand
Hi
Well I re timed the cam to what I thought it should be , it was 90 deg off :lol: So thought I would see if it had any compression , I got 130 psi on #1 cyl and only 80 psi on #2 but the batt was stuffed by then . Its on charge and I will try again . What should I be looking for , did not think 130 would have been too far off the mark for a turbo engine that is cold on a sluggish battery .

Anyhow here are a couple more pic's .

Image

Image

Image

And how thought there was not much wiring to conect up :o

Image

And thats not all of it as I seem to be missing another loom for the other side that deals with the electronic ignition . At this stage without any wiring diagrams and details on how to plumb the vacuum lines , I will never get it running . My best bet is to convert it to single point efi and a megasquirt ecu . This will be able to recieve the signal from the dissy etc so I will not have to change that . If anything happened to the carb I would never be able to get parts for it anyway .

So on the look out for a TBI injector , I would really like to keep the top manifold if at all possible so it would look original so do any tbi's have the stalk out the top like carb'sdo to screw down a filter etc . I can see an afternoon wasted at the wrecker looking for one :( .

Cheers
Chris


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 4:02 pm 
Offline
Sad but True...

Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 8:20 pm
Posts: 2973
Location: Saskatchewan
wow thats kind of cool,

you should do a comp test with a charged battery, WOT and no fuel (obviously) and report back

_________________
1991 Swift GT Build G10 +25 psi + other goodies
1996 Metro Build QR25de swap, still undecided where to take it
the lolcar family


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 7:10 pm 
Offline
Suzuki Elder
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2003 12:47 pm
Posts: 11669
Location: columbus, ohio
take the carb hat off and get a good, clear shot of the carb. phil n ed or j,v&s might know what you have. even better, they might have parts that fit it.

is the displacement 1 liter or 660 cc?

for sure on the electronic carb you'll find a valve that cuts fuel with key operation. japanese electric carbs usually have a lot in common with pachinko machines which means that you'll probably want to find wiring documentation for it.

cool rig, though. i hope you can use it.

_________________
1991 Blue Geo Metro Convertible highly modified 1.0L Turbo3 5 spd. - 1991 Red Geo Metro Convertible customized with a Twincam 5 spd.

My Turbo3 Project
My Cardomain Page -Ol' Blue
My YouTube Channel
My Photo Gallery
SAAB Sonett II


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 9:40 pm 
Offline
Island Inbreeder
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:56 pm
Posts: 6347
Location: Emerald city Washington
Very cool..!!
My bet it's a throttle body of some kind ....don't Know..??
Yes please take the hat off and shot me some pictures thanks ----GV&S
.
.
.
from the picture i can see a fuel pump so it is a carb model..??
ther should be a tab on the side or a stamp that give a carb #

Image

_________________
.

t3 ragtop wrote:
the 3 banger isn't at all a "grenade." it's a tough little son of a bitch doing a big job. respect it.
suprf1y wrote:
I didn't save anything.Vehicles are to me, like little boys are to Tommy.Toys to be abused for my own personal pleasure.
jrjd wrote:
"Driving a Swift GTi is like driving a bike in your house".


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 04, 2008 9:53 pm 
Offline
Island Inbreeder
User avatar

Joined: Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:56 pm
Posts: 6347
Location: Emerald city Washington
the number for are carburators are MR08
.
Image
.
Image

_________________
.

t3 ragtop wrote:
the 3 banger isn't at all a "grenade." it's a tough little son of a bitch doing a big job. respect it.
suprf1y wrote:
I didn't save anything.Vehicles are to me, like little boys are to Tommy.Toys to be abused for my own personal pleasure.
jrjd wrote:
"Driving a Swift GTi is like driving a bike in your house".


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 4:53 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2008 2:49 am
Posts: 10
Location: New Zealand
Well all good things come to those who wait :)

After wrapping the engine up and putting it in the corner of the shed for a rainy day a guy down country a bit advertised wrecking a cultus turbo so contacted him to get the loom complete , that way I could figure out how to wire this one up and get it running hopefully . Anyway ended getting just about all the engine and complete loom , while taking to him about what I wanted and why he says " oh I have a wiring diagrams here " , bugger but sweet . So now I have a complete spare engine and turbo etc .

Wait and see whats there when all the parts turn up but hope to get one going with the carb on it , would be cool to keep it original . He says his is out of a 1983 cultus , so a few years old now . When I uncover it I will look at the carb number and see how it compares to the post above .

Cheers
Chris


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 5:15 pm 
Offline
a.k.a Bum head
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 31, 2004 5:29 pm
Posts: 3157
Location: London, ON
Holy poop... '83? Did they have Cultii that long ago?

_________________
Good stuff for sale!

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=42901&start=0


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 7:54 pm 
Offline
Teamswift Racer
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2004 5:56 am
Posts: 2328
Location: Christchurch NZ, quake capital
83 was the first year of the leaf spring model cultus(swift for export markets) I have seen one of these around town, lite metallic blue with 'Turbo 3' decal on the hatch, no spoliers or sideskirts, this model ran until 85 when it was redesigned with coil springs, also the t3 got efi.

AFAIK the early T3's weren't sold anywhere outside of Japan but NZ has imported lots of used Japanese cars since the mid eighties so hence a few made it to our shores.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 10:07 pm 
Offline
The Smuggler
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jun 10, 2004 12:34 am
Posts: 2885
Location: Surrey, BC CANADA
I feel like Indiana Jones watching something from the past that nobody knew about suddenly appear out of the mist.

It's interestin to know good ol Suzuki was playin with these 3cyl turbo's further back that the very first 86 we saw in north America.

Why they stopped making them and selling them I can't figure out.
Fun Fuel efficient cars that are still being resurected from the piles of derelict scrap heaps.
By us cheap thrill seeking Suzuki lovers.

A 1983 3cyl turbo, that's gonna throw our Mk1/ 2 theory out the window.

Very kool to see a motor like that, we are all very interseted in following what you plan on doing with it.
To us here in North America it is a rare thing to see a motor like that.
I can hear JVS cryin from his garage as I write this.
Keep us posted with lots of pics please.

_________________
"I love the whine of a turbo in the mornin" 1991 Sprint Turbo
"I also love the 7500 rpm scream of a DOHC" :razz: 2X 1989 Swift GTi's a 92 and Jr's new 93 GT

Keep your eye on the boost guage!
And I love this one!
"Dale Jarrett's crew chief" "Drive it like ya STOLE IT!"
Image


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 4:08 pm 
Offline
Suzuki Elder
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2003 12:47 pm
Posts: 11669
Location: columbus, ohio
Knuckles wrote:
I can hear JVS cryin from his garage as I write this.


the sound you're hearing is more likely scott spanking the monkey to the pics of a carbed turbo suzuki engine. :ez_pimp:

_________________
1991 Blue Geo Metro Convertible highly modified 1.0L Turbo3 5 spd. - 1991 Red Geo Metro Convertible customized with a Twincam 5 spd.

My Turbo3 Project
My Cardomain Page -Ol' Blue
My YouTube Channel
My Photo Gallery
SAAB Sonett II


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 11:11 pm 
Offline
Teamswift Racer
User avatar

Joined: Fri Apr 02, 2004 5:56 am
Posts: 2328
Location: Christchurch NZ, quake capital
Knuckles wrote:
I feel like Indiana Jones watching something from the past that nobody knew about suddenly appear out of the mist.

A 1983 3cyl turbo, that's gonna throw our Mk1/ 2 theory out the window.

The teamswift labeling model is full of holes anyway, this early type mk1 with the rear leaf springs was sold in the US as a sprint, I know Phil N Ed has an 85 model, it's just that it's non turbo, most export markets got this early type as a 1324cc G13a where as the States got a few 993cc non turbo models and what we call a mk1 86-88 is technically only a facelift version, more like a mk1 phase 2 as they like to call them in the UK or if you like a 2nd edition 1st generation model.

Certainly is an interesting engine, I know the first generation of Daihatsu 1 litre engines (approx 1985) were carbi before they introduced the 12 valve 3 cyl gtti engine that completely changed peoples perceptions of a 'pocket rocket' in this part of the world.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 1:01 pm 
Offline
Sad but True...

Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 8:20 pm
Posts: 2973
Location: Saskatchewan
this is cool and all, and neat that its something new, but what good is it really? even the t3s had a measly 70bhp, I dont imagine this having more than 60 really. would be cool to say you have it though

_________________
1991 Swift GT Build G10 +25 psi + other goodies
1996 Metro Build QR25de swap, still undecided where to take it
the lolcar family


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 4:19 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun May 22, 2005 9:56 pm
Posts: 1146
Location: Saint-Jérôme, Qc
I wouldn't be surprised if this carbed version got more power than a 90 turbo3...

_________________
Suzuki Gold Master Tech
'07 Suzuki SX4 JLX AWD 2.0 | Turbine Tech turbo kit @ 7psi
'08 Suzuki SX4 Sport 2.0 , average baby carrier


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Oct 20, 2008 6:38 pm 
Offline
Suzuki Elder
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2003 12:47 pm
Posts: 11669
Location: columbus, ohio
i used to prefer a carb over fuel injection for the very fact that i could make more hp with them. :ez_smokin:

_________________
1991 Blue Geo Metro Convertible highly modified 1.0L Turbo3 5 spd. - 1991 Red Geo Metro Convertible customized with a Twincam 5 spd.

My Turbo3 Project
My Cardomain Page -Ol' Blue
My YouTube Channel
My Photo Gallery
SAAB Sonett II


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 12:31 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2008 2:49 am
Posts: 10
Location: New Zealand
The label on the top says it makes 80PS , but since when has anyone believed a makers claim ;)

It will make the world of difference to the car it goes in as it has a 4cyl 45 hp engine now , so a lighter 3cly ~70hp engine will be a good kick in the guts .
This assuems I can get it running ok :(

Chris


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Oct 22, 2008 4:56 pm 
Offline
a.k.a Bum head
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 31, 2004 5:29 pm
Posts: 3157
Location: London, ON
Didn't notice that plate on the carb hat... can you get a closer picture of it? It's got all sorts of nice info on it. :D

_________________
Good stuff for sale!

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=42901&start=0


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 9:38 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2008 1:43 am
Posts: 95
Location: Bangor and Portland, ME
im really curious, is it really a carb engine. I know there is plenty of turbo carb stuff out there, but quickly looking at the pics, it looks as if it uses the same intake as the tbi non turbo, which happens to have injector bung bosses(on mine anyway) But my real question is, what is the object that i have circled, it looks to be an injector, and its in the spot where the injector could possibly be, and we havent gotten any more pics of the engine with the carb hat off it. Not trying to ruffle feathers, just very curious on this new find.

Image

_________________
You know the RED area of the tach...Thats called "The FUN Zone"
91 Metro 4door T3 megasquirt, srt4 ic, stainless header with k03, 2.5" stainless exhaust
94 Mustang GT 5liter Turbo Megasquirt
http://www.UNTAMND.com


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 6:31 pm 
Offline
Suzuki Elder
User avatar

Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2003 12:47 pm
Posts: 11669
Location: columbus, ohio
that's definitely a carbed turbo engine. what you have circled is more likely a pressure transducer or an air injection solenoid.

what makes me think that it's not injected in any manner is the mechanical fuel pump that can be seen in your first pics. a mechanical pump usually can't develop enough pressure or hold the pressure steady enough to be useable with an injector. the exceptions are pretty much the timed mechanical injection pumps that you find on diesel engines (but those don't require as small of a droplet in the mist as does a gas engine.)

an important function of an injector is to develop a mist of fuel which requires that the fuel pressure is higher than can be developed by a mechanically coupled diaphragm. remember that the fuel delivery of a mechanical pump changes with engine rpms (usually at the rate of one stroke per revolution.)

conversely, a high pressure electric fuel pump doesn't work very well with a carb. if the fuel is delivered at too high a pressure, the float needle gets blown off it's seat, the bowl overflows, and floods the engine.

_________________
1991 Blue Geo Metro Convertible highly modified 1.0L Turbo3 5 spd. - 1991 Red Geo Metro Convertible customized with a Twincam 5 spd.

My Turbo3 Project
My Cardomain Page -Ol' Blue
My YouTube Channel
My Photo Gallery
SAAB Sonett II


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 8:33 pm 
Offline
a.k.a Bum head
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 31, 2004 5:29 pm
Posts: 3157
Location: London, ON
Part of the PCV system?

_________________
Good stuff for sale!

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=42901&start=0


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Oct 28, 2008 9:29 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 27, 2008 1:43 am
Posts: 95
Location: Bangor and Portland, ME
CJDavE wrote:
Part of the PCV system?


After looking at the pic of the other engine, it looks to be a vacuum port.
Very nifty little engine and setup thats for sure. Keep us posted with how things turn out and what else you find for info on it.

_________________
You know the RED area of the tach...Thats called "The FUN Zone"
91 Metro 4door T3 megasquirt, srt4 ic, stainless header with k03, 2.5" stainless exhaust
94 Mustang GT 5liter Turbo Megasquirt
http://www.UNTAMND.com


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Wed Oct 29, 2008 5:35 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Sep 24, 2005 10:33 pm
Posts: 302
Location: Waukegan, IL
CJDavE wrote:
Didn't notice that plate on the carb hat... can you get a closer picture of it? It's got all sorts of nice info on it. :D



I can make out 'knock controlled'....


We demand pics inside the presumed carb hat! =)

_________________
Corviar Turbo, G10 turbo Inno Mini, Turbo VW bug.....Next?


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 45 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 4 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group