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Underbody braces, turbos and more!

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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 3:21 am 
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Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2007 10:51 pm
Posts: 153
Location: boise id
Ok so im buying my dads 87 chevy sprint turbo. Car runs great while driving it but as of lately it has started having a low idle issue and if it is let idle for more than about 3-5 minutes it dies. Starts right back up again. What could this be? Any adjustments to a tps or iacv or anything like that? also it has 240k miles or so on it. He has changed the plugs and wires and cap and rotor and also the fuel pump. Thanks for the help gents


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 3:45 am 
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Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
idling speed control (isc, iac, whatever) is at possibly fault...

do you rev the engine to 800-1k rpm while idling if the rpm is stumble? if so then isc is bad

tps is not for idling...


but why replace rotor/cap (i recommend completely distributor tho) and fuel pump... something wrong in the past?

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sorry bout my bad english


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 12:11 pm 
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Location: boise id
Cap and rotor were part of basic tune for miles on car. And i ment fuel filter lol. Pump is original.


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 3:10 pm 
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my money would be on the ics (idle control solenoid.) that seems to be a usual problem with those pinball carburetors.

those cars are nearly 27 years old and the fact that the electrical components have lasted this long is a testament to their engineering.

i'm not a mk1 guy. you need dr. phil (phil n ed.)

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1991 Blue Geo Metro Convertible highly modified 1.0L Turbo3 5 spd. - 1991 Red Geo Metro Convertible customized with a Twincam 5 spd.

My Turbo3 Project
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 3:55 pm 
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Location: Arizona
Its a T3 , there is no carburetor =)


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 4:33 pm 
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Location: boise id
Yea what he^ said lol


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:32 pm 
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Location: Palm Springs: Too hot from June to Oct.!
What are the codes...???

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DIY Broken Bolt Removal: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=41042
DIY Clutch Adjustment: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=48281
DIY Wheel Bearings: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=29003
DIY Shocks: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=45483
DIY Wheel Align: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=42479
Once you get the cars dialed-in (compression, leaks, bearings, alignment, brakes) swap in new rubber and glass, you've got something which should last for years!


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 10:26 pm 
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Probably the load vsv's need adjustment and/or the idle screw on the throttle body

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1987 Chevrolet Sprint Turbo under construction


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PostPosted: Sun Nov 24, 2013 11:33 pm 
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Location: boise id
What is a load vsv? Ill check the idle screw in the morning. Also i havent had the chance to check the codes yet. No engine lights though.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 12:17 am 
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On the firewall to the left of the coil there are the electrical load valve and ac idle valve (if you have ac).
image_id: 23726

First if check all the vacuum lines to make sure they're routed properly.
image_id: 23727

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1987 Chevrolet Sprint Turbo under construction


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 12:45 am 
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Location: boise id
It doesnt have ac and and im sure the vacume lines are correct as the car is 100% bone stock.


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 1:18 am 
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Location: Palmdale, Ca
You'd be surprised

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1987 Chevrolet Sprint Turbo under construction


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PostPosted: Mon Nov 25, 2013 9:42 pm 
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Location: boise id
Lol ok how bout that my dad has had the car for 18 years and it has run fine all those years. This is a recent issue with thia car and nothing changed. I adjusted the electric load valve and it smoothed out the idle at first then went eight back to the same issue on the drive home. Ill try the idle set screw tomorrow.


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 12:04 am 
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Location: Palm Springs: Too hot from June to Oct.!
Don't check for codes.
Don't look at the book.
Just replace things until you find the problem.
Situation well under control!
:D :D :D

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DIY Broken Bolt Removal: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=41042
DIY Clutch Adjustment: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=48281
DIY Wheel Bearings: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=29003
DIY Shocks: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=45483
DIY Wheel Align: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=42479
Once you get the cars dialed-in (compression, leaks, bearings, alignment, brakes) swap in new rubber and glass, you've got something which should last for years!


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:38 am 
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Location: Palm Springs: Too hot from June to Oct.!
It would have been better if your Dad had GIVEN you the car, but what is done is done.

At 240,000 miles you will probably have to remove the engine and rebuild it completely.

Those who have posted above are familiar with your car, either owning one, previously owned one, or have worked on them extensively. Yes, they even have Idaho license plates:
Image

Teamswift is the correct forum to get your car running in tip top shape.
The members give commonly accepted advice for troubleshooting your problems and some are highly respected 'automotive technicians'.

They are not only critical thinkers, they are able to fix any of the cars that are presented.

In your specific case, you will have to hone your posting skills to get free help.
Here is an example of poor posting skills:



This tells the viewer absolutely nothing.
It shows a situation with no reference.
Useless.

If you take the advice from the group above, your car may run more like this:

Image
...and still get 40+ miles per gallon.

Reminder: both pictures above can be clicked for the video.

Your low idle and then dies problem could be as serious as a complete engine rebuild to something as simple as an incorrect rotor.

Posting codes requires NO tools and is free to do. A real no brainer. OBD II cars? You will have to buy a code reader. Fortunately, your Turbo Sprint is OBD I and requires no tools to retrieve codes.

Posting a video also is free. It tells us your skill level and attention to detail. We can spot things you'd miss or ask questions you'd not think of.

You may think we are being hard on you, but some of the guys above have been given cars from their Dads (like you) and have put thousands of dollars into them with amazing results.

Man up - you are amongst the most experienced group of Turbo Sprint owners in the world.
Grab your wrenches, take compression readings, post videos and bring the car back into specs.

Be proud of what you own and how it runs, thanks to your directed, logical and carefully thought out efforts. What will you do with all the money you save from our advice?

_________________
DIY Broken Bolt Removal: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=41042
DIY Clutch Adjustment: viewtopic.php?f=9&t=48281
DIY Wheel Bearings: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=29003
DIY Shocks: viewtopic.php?f=10&t=45483
DIY Wheel Align: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=42479
Once you get the cars dialed-in (compression, leaks, bearings, alignment, brakes) swap in new rubber and glass, you've got something which should last for years!


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PostPosted: Tue Nov 26, 2013 1:25 pm 
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Location: Arizona
Phil N Ed wrote:
Don't check for codes.
Don't look at the book.
Just replace things until you find the problem.
Situation well under control!
:D :D :D


:lol: :lol: :lol: :werd:


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 6:38 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2007 10:51 pm
Posts: 153
Location: boise id
Just to clarify i didn't think that anyone above was being a jerk lol. The history on the car. My dad bought it from a 72 year old lady who was the original owner. She had the dealer papers from when she bought it here in boise. It was her daily driver till she couldn't drive any more. My dad is a retired master mechanic from both fiat and chevy. He has just driven it. the engine bay other than doing a 2.25 cat back exhaust is stock. suspension is stock. drive train is stock.

Now on to the current issue lol. I just flipped the switch and hit the key. the engine light blinked one then two. thats it. The plugs wires and cap and rotor were done when we did the timing belt 20k miles ago. The car had a bad knock sensor and i got a good one from mike on here. (superfly) timing is dead on. car has 246xxx miles on it. thats all i can think of right now. I am planning on doing a comp. test on friday when i have time off from my two jobs. ill update then with the numbers i pull.


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 9:05 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 01, 2003 12:47 pm
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Location: columbus, ohio
12 is the okay, no codes stored response.

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1991 Blue Geo Metro Convertible highly modified 1.0L Turbo3 5 spd. - 1991 Red Geo Metro Convertible customized with a Twincam 5 spd.

My Turbo3 Project
My Cardomain Page -Ol' Blue
My YouTube Channel
My Photo Gallery
SAAB Sonett II


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 9:09 pm 
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Location: London, ON
Do you have a spare MAF to try?

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Good stuff for sale!

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=42901&start=0


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 27, 2013 11:08 pm 
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Location: boise id
No i dont have one. Just the one on the car.


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PostPosted: Thu Nov 28, 2013 2:18 pm 
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Location: So Cal, USA
Post up some good pics of the engine bay,
and a video of the problem if you can.

I suspect vacuum issues, you want to check all the vacuum
lines (lots of them) for cracks or looseness.

Check the IAC is routed properly (vacuum diagram sticker
on underside of hood) and check the wiring. These cars are
famous for having broken wires.
Does it happen when it's cold only or also at operating temp?
If cold, I would check the wiring to the cold start injector,
those wires are famous for breaking.

Also check your coolant level, you can have some idle issues
if the coolant is not full and not in contact with your
temp sensors.

You may want to check the underside of the Intercooler,
these cars are famous for having broken I/C mount brackets
and the vibration causes holes in the bottom of the I/C
if it rubs on the bracket due to broken mounts.

Pull off the intake hose and inspect the throttle body,
if it's dirty inside there and on the flap that will cause
issues as well, there are pinholes around the circumference
of the throttle flap, see if they are gummed up.

These cars have idle issues if you have any leaks,
check the oil cap gasket to see if intact and sealing
properly, also the oil dipstick seal by the handle,
it needs to be fully inserted and sealed.

Obviously check the air filter to see if it's clogged, and the
intake tube from the VAF to the turbo, these crack in the bellows
so give it a good visual inspection. Basic stuff, fuel filter,
check the plugs..correct type and check the gap.
Compression check won't hurt.
Check the ignition wires are fully inserted/locked on,
coil wire, etc.

Good luck


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2013 2:49 am 
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Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2007 10:51 pm
Posts: 153
Location: boise id
ok so as an update....and to answer questions asked. (sorry no pics or videos yet)
I checked all the vacuum lines i could find and all felt very pliable (not too soft though) and couldn't find any cracks or leaks (doesn't mean it couldn't still be lol)
i double checked the lines on the sticker for the iac and it is correct as far as i can tell.
I don't have a multimeter at home (its at my work and locked in a building) but i wiggled the wires going into the iac and the cold start injector and it didn't make a difference.
It does it at all temps. both on first start up and after fully warm.
coolant level is full and no leaks.
the intercooler mount bracket is still intact and it pulls a full 7lbs of boost. I did not take the intercooler off to check it though. I did install an autometer boost/vacuum gauge i had at home so I could check the levels it had. also on decel it has 23 lbs of vacuum and at idle about 16lbs of vacuum.
i have not pulled off the intake hose yet but i am going to try tomorrow.
i pulled off the intake hose and had no leaks doing a pressure test at 5 lbs of positive pressure. (i work in a radiator shop)
it has autolite plugs in it so i purchased ngk's today and will put them in tomorrow to see if that helps.
I did a compression test yesterday but was in a hurry and a botard and didn't do it at w.o.t. so i will redo the compression test tomorrow while changing the plugs to the new ngk ones. numbers at closed throttle were 135-132-135. also was done at complete cold engine temps first thing in the morning.
as for cma's question yes it does stumble up till about 1400 rpm. after that it clears out and runs great. I tried adjusting the iac again and it did absolutely nothing.

I have also noticed that it is kind of and intermittent problem. (more often than not) but there are times that it runs perfect at idle at a stop light then the next light the problem is back.

also it doesn't seem like the cold start system is working (possibly the broken wires mentioned above) as it doesn't have a high idle when first started.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2013 5:37 am 
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Location: Prince George B.C. Canada
I can't help on the overall problem but just "wiggling a wire" can't always tell you if there is a problem with the wire. Spend the $15 on your own multimeter. Check the wiring properly.


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2013 9:27 am 
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i'm not a mk1 guy but there was something in your last post that reminded me that on my mk2 turbo3 i could always tell when it was time to clean the air filter when it had the low speed stumble that didn't clear up until after the engine revs got above around 2000 rpm.

another known problem with the turbo3 controls is that the gate in the vaf gets "sticky." you can drop a little light oil onto the pivot bearing and that helps to free up the gate.

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1991 Blue Geo Metro Convertible highly modified 1.0L Turbo3 5 spd. - 1991 Red Geo Metro Convertible customized with a Twincam 5 spd.

My Turbo3 Project
My Cardomain Page -Ol' Blue
My YouTube Channel
My Photo Gallery
SAAB Sonett II


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PostPosted: Sat Nov 30, 2013 11:49 am 
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Joined: Thu Feb 22, 2007 10:51 pm
Posts: 153
Location: boise id
I thought of the air filter as well and tried taking the air filter out and tested it in my garage. It didnt help. Ill try to oil the maf. What oil would be suggested for this?


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