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Underbody braces, turbos and more!

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2005 2:40 pm 
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Factory "approval" for aftermarket part depends on who you talk to. Obviously you'd have a more interesting conversation with an engineer, than you would with their corporate lawer.

When you mod an engine, the power you extract from the new parts arises from either: improving its efficiency, or making compromises to fuel economy/long-term longevity/environmental damage/etc. Obviously one must weigh the pros and cons of any mods they're planning. For example, I'm not a big fan of underdrive pullies.

I'm also not entirely convinced of the safety of mixing alcohol with the factory fuel system, which is why I urged conservative use, if one is to experiment with it. Likewise, if you look at the fuel recommendation TSB, you can see Suzuki isn't too happy about methanol being in the tank. Obviously you wouldn't want to leave it there for very long (and flush it out when you're done) or otherwise dilute it.

I indeed read the TSB on crankshaft grinding, I was one who posted it. I felt that people would probably like to know:
• GTi crankshafts are nitrided on top of being forged
• Suzuki doesn't make undersized bearings available
• Suzuki would rather sell you a crank than undersized bearings
• If you're grinding the journals anyway, it would be a good idea to have it nitrided afterwards, and locate a custom bearing supplier. But you would need the TSB to determine that though.

In the end, it's up to the reader to make an interpretation based on available sources. I'm just trying to provide as many useful sources of information as possible.

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 22, 2005 2:40 pm 
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98Metr0$ wrote:
Honestly Acetone scares me, it is very harsh and could strip deposits, ruin rubber seals and gum up stuff.


Acetone is fairly nasty. There was a lot of people who used to mix it in large quantities their gas back in the 70's shortage. The large ratio did harm to engines and componets and left a bad taste for this trick. What I see suggested now is only 3-4oz per 10gal (about .3%). I'd like to think I can put 3-4oz of anything in my gas tank and not get an adverse effect. The acetone cost me $5 for 32oz, so it's really only going to be about 50cents/tank and will be less if I buy in bigger quantities. I use a graduated turkey baster (which gets me odd looks).

The idea is that the acetone acts as an evaporating agent, not as a energy/burning additive. When the fuel gets sprayed into the cylinder its a fog/liquid mix. The fog burns much better than the liquid. The evaporating agent causes the injected fuel to form more of a fog.

Warmer fuel fogs better as well, which is one of my suggestions, but more complicated to implement.

This certianly does not increase Octane. Octane is basically a rating on how easily the fuel ignites. For gas milage you really want the fuel to be easy to ignite to throughly burn any gas going into the engine. Normaly higher octane = lower milage, so I don't know why theres a lot of chatter about rasing octanes.

Jay W
505/287 Dakota


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PostPosted: Wed Apr 13, 2005 4:01 pm 
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My oldie, an 86 2 door. I managed one time one trip to pull 77 mpg aout of it, no rear seats, no spare, no rear panels, uh, lets see, freeway only, lots of coasting, I had 8.5 wires and splitfires, a, msd coil, and a 6al? box. I had modified the intake so it went straight from the frint of the engine bay, not the funny insulated hoses running all willy nilly in there. I could get over 60 mpg regualrly, oh yeah 94 octane all the time, sometimes with an octane boost like 104. Ah, 65 mpg was normal for me, I drove it mre than 300km a day, delivering pizza and being a nut-bar teen. so yeah, my goal was 100mpg, but i think I would have needed some heavy duty cash to pull it off, like 7 lb rims and rollercam, no passsenger seat or dash, you get the idea 86s rock!

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 14, 2005 8:19 am 
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I am trying the acetone trick with this current tank of gas in my Metro. Last fill up I got 45 MPG with mixed driving with out it. Mostly I am cruising around 60 MPH with some stop and go lights and a short drive on the interstate at 75 MPH. It is a 10 gal tank and I added 2 oz. of pure acetone and 3 oz of Marvel Mystery Oil for upper cylinder lube.

I have not noticed any difference in the movement of the fuel gauge in comparison to mileage, but it does seem to start easier and has a little more pep when taking off.

I'll post MPG when I fill up again.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 10:16 am 
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UPDATE:

Well after using the acetone I got 44 MPG. But, I did manage to go 200 miles to the half tank mark. Usually I can only go 150-170. I was also driving very agressive because it seemed to have a little more power.

I think the acetone would make more of a difference in a carburated car with no computer controls. I have a feeling the O2 sensor saw more oxygen in the exhaust and added more fuel resulting in slightly less economy.

I did not add any acetone to the current tank and I it seems the fuel gauge is moving a little quicker than with the acetone. It also doesn't start as easily as it did with the acetone and the throttle response isn't as snappy. I will try again after this tank.

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M3----"M" body "3" cylinders.
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"M3 like the BMW?"
"No, like the Gillette razor."


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 11:43 am 
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try some moth balls, about 5 of them in a full tank. that'll kick the octane rating up a bit by boosting the airomatic hydrocarbons. it's not as hard on rubber and plastic as acetone.

oxygenated fuels are kind of tricky.

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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 11:55 am 
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The reason for using acetone is to help atomize the fuel and break the surface tension of the gasoline so it burns more efficiently. It does have an octane rating of 150 but, the small quantity doesn't really "boost" the gasolines octane rating.

I read about the acetone here http://pesn.com/2005/03/17/6900069_Acetone/

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"M3 like the BMW?"
"No, like the Gillette razor."


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 25, 2005 10:46 pm 
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t3 ragtop wrote:
try some moth balls, about 5 of them in a full tank. that'll kick the octane rating up a bit by boosting the airomatic hydrocarbons. it's not as hard on rubber and plastic as acetone.

oxygenated fuels are kind of tricky.


I hear they are extremely corrosive to the cylinder/valves (?) At least that's what my shop teacher said back in high school in 1982. Does increase octane though.

Then again he said a lot of things that ended up not being true.

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1992 Geo metro, 1.0L 5spd, 511,000miles on original engine & trans
- First time engine work at 456K miles, bad headgasket. Rebuilt head, Felpro gasket installed.
- knuckles/hubs/brakes/13" wheels from a 2000 Metro, running 175 70R13
- New bearings and 1st/2nd synchros at 440.5K miles.
- MPGuino
- Averaging ~ 51MPG these days


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PostPosted: Tue Apr 26, 2005 5:35 pm 
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Okay, I'm back on the juice (acetone). As I mentioned I previously tried acetone in one tank and saw a gain. Now I've changed the timing belt, replaced the stuck open T'stat and have gotten a non-acetone baseline (5 tank fulls) of 46-47mpg. I filled up today with the acetone doping of 3oz. I've got some up and down California driving to do next week. I will report back.

Jay W
505/287 Dakota


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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2005 10:47 pm 
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I did try Acetone @ 3 oz per 10 gallon in my 96 Dodge 3/4 ton pickup with 360 v8 and 4:10 rear end. Couldn't see an increase in mpg. Of course with the 3/4 ton and 4:10 rearend you don't get as much of a difference in mpg in different driving conditions , it Sucks gas like a big dawg!

The study I saw said there was no deleterious effect of a fractional percentage of pure acetone in gasoline on plastic, rubber parts. I may try it on my 98 metro 1.0

I'm not skeered!

Please note that more acetone does not equal more mpg. After a certain amount mpg actually drops off with increasing percentage of Assatone.
From what I understand too much octane decreases fuel mileage.

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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2005 10:52 pm 
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spt-3x1.0 wrote:
This dryer vent hose idea might look & sound weird ,but its really helping out on fuel economy & even has a bit more power now that air flow is less restrictive.


Doesn't heated air intake just increase fuel mileage or does it also help power. I'd heard that hot air intake (better fuel atomization/vaporization) increases fuel mileage while you want cold air intake for more power (denser air charge)

I might test the "hot box" thing sometime

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PostPosted: Tue May 10, 2005 3:25 pm 
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MetroMods wrote:
Doesn't heated air intake just increase fuel mileage or does it also help power. I'd heard that hot air intake (better fuel atomization/vaporization) increases fuel mileage while you want cold air intake for more power (denser air charge)

Warm air decrease power. Like you said, less dense intake charge.

On my two acetone tanks I've gone from a baseline of 46mpg to 49 then 51.4mpg.

Jay W
505/287 Dakota


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PostPosted: Tue May 10, 2005 3:38 pm 
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How much acetone did you add to a full tank?

I tried 2oz for the 10 gallon tank and saw no difference in MPG.

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"M3 like the BMW?"
"No, like the Gillette razor."


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PostPosted: Tue May 10, 2005 5:39 pm 
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M3 wrote:
How much acetone did you add to a full tank?

I tried 2oz for the 10 gallon tank and saw no difference in MPG.

3oz/10gal. (usually only 2.5oz since I put in 8.25gal). I reaad it takes 3 to 4oz per 10 gal.

I don't know why, but some of the "experts" say it may take a couple of tanks to see the mpg increase. I think the acetone first gets used to get rid of the water that's accumulated in your gas tank, then cleans out deposits, THEN starts improving your MPGs.

I saw the above jump right away though.

PS, my best mpg ever (in just over a year I've owned the car) was 48. So the impovement I'm seeing isn't seasonal.

Jay W
505/287 Dakota


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PostPosted: Tue May 10, 2005 6:13 pm 
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Remove the tire, jack etc. And replace all that weight with a can of 'tire inflate/repair'. It's everyway better. It will quickly get you back on the road. It's cheap, light.

By the time you open your hatch, and move stuff around to get the spare out, you'll already be driving if you use the 'flat tire repair thingy in a can'.

$6 Cad.

I don't know why anyone bothers changing tires on the side of a road, when you could use this stuff instead. Everyone should be carrying a can (even if you keep your spare).


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PostPosted: Tue May 10, 2005 6:27 pm 
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ehos wrote:
Remove the tire, jack etc. And replace all that weight with a can of 'tire inflate/repair'. It's everyway better. It will quickly get you back on the road. It's cheap, light.

By the time you open your hatch, and move stuff around to get the spare out, you'll already be driving if you use the 'flat tire repair thingy in a can'.

$6 Cad.

I don't know why anyone bothers changing tires on the side of a road, when you could use this stuff instead. Everyone should be carrying a can (even if you keep your spare).


I cary one of thoes can things, and a spare tire, the tire thing saved us on I94 when we were going to chicago a few years ago, it gave us time to get to an exit and find a repair shop since we didn't have a spare in the car at the time.


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 6:30 pm 
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so this acetone is octane booster?? :?


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PostPosted: Wed Aug 17, 2005 7:08 pm 
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spt-3x1.0 wrote:
This is what i did the other day & it really seam to be working but i will wait till friday to fill up & do a road trip just to find out how well.
Disconnect the intake tube from the air cleaner cover & from the inner fender panel.
DON'T toss the two piece band that held the tube adapter to the air cleaner cover, you will still need that.
Go to hardware store or walmart & get the aluninum 4"x4' flex hose that used for dryer vents,clamp one end to air cleaner cover using stock band & route along inner fender towards the front in the same location as the stock intake tube was.Tie this up by making a bracket as i did or use bailing wire or a zip tie to prevent hose from sagging into pulleys path.
After tieing it up then just let the rest of the hose rest along the top of the exhaust manifold & the other end ending next to the radiator/core support opening.
I will be adding a 90% elbow & attaching it to the panel thats mounted next to the radiator where the a/c condensor would go if you had one & hooking the inlet end of the hose to that giving even more direct from the front of car air flow
This will give you much better air flow to the air cleaner & at the same time the air will be heated by the exhaust manifold creating better fuel economy.
To add to this you could change to a K&N air filter,there a lifetime reusable filter & im thinking of even making my input fuel line much longer & wrapping it around my upper radiator hose to heat up the fuel.
For a carburated vehicle this wont work it will just cause a vapor lock,but being that the Metros are fuel injected the fuel pump is in the gas tank.
This dryer vent hose idea might look & sound weird ,but its really helping out on fuel economy & even has a bit more power now that air flow is less restrictive.
I'll let you know what my fuel economy is in the next few weeks or so if not sooner.


Couple of points -

On the carburetted Swifts, at least the one I have, there is a duct on the exhaust manifold that connects to a damper valve in the air filter housing. On a cold day, the damper valve forces the engine to breathe through the duct, drawing in fresh air over the hot exhaust manifold, warming it in the process.

The intake maniflod and the carburettor base are also hooked into the cooling system, so that they are actually warmed by the hot water circulating, in much the same way as the heater core gets warmed.

Finally - my fuel pump is in the tank, exactly like it is on the injected cars.


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PostPosted: Thu Aug 18, 2005 1:48 am 
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supadupa wrote:
so this acetone is octane booster?? :?

You can also use toluene or xylene. There's info both on here and the rest of internet on how to mix your own high octane fuel.
:search: + "toluene"

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 26, 2005 2:50 pm 
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supadupa wrote:
so this acetone is octane booster?? :?

Acetone can be an octane booster, but in the way I'm using it, no. The amount is too small to boost octane. It's being used as an evaporating agent. Helps fog the gas when it enters the cylinder, which makes it burn more throughly.

Jay W
505/287 Dakota


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