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Underbody braces, turbos and more!

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 01, 2006 11:13 am 
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Joined: Tue May 23, 2006 1:48 pm
Posts: 415
Location: portland oregon
Check here.
http://www.mooneyesusa.com/catalog/inde ... 188_52_119
john :D


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 1:58 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 24, 2008 7:47 am
Posts: 124
might as well drop my 2c on the flywheel issue...

lightweight flywheel for cars that are doing a lot of rapid accel/decel ie. road course car
"heavier" flywheel for cars drag racing (extra stored kinetic nrg helps off the line)
stock flywheels for the rest of us...

engineers put that much mass on there for a reason. if they could have gone lighter and saved a few pennies without hurting performance or economy they would have.

now for other mods for fuel economy... aero mods: moonies and wheel covers help, vents for the wheel wells help (i've not seen anyone do that yet but i'm going to. tighter panel gaps/filler panels help. belly pan was already mentioned. shaving mirrors, handles etc help. skinny high pressure tires help. fresh wheel bearings installed a little 'loose' with synthetic grease helps. lowering the car, front air dams etc all help.

i'm actually going to completely block my front openings and do an air damn that draws all air from underneath. ala 3rd/4th gen f bodies and c5/c6 vettes.

motor mods: make your engine a more efficient pump... head work, intake, exhaust. micro polish crank and main bearings, over sized bearings/cut journals helps. crank scraper and windage tray. polished and/or ceramic coated combustion chambers. under cut or spiral cut valves, higher compression ratio. the pistons and rods are already so light i'm not sure there is much weight to be saved there.

of all of these i think the head, intake and exhaust should be priority #1. the valves are hella shrowded. not sure if there is much to be gained on the intake or TB.

timing/fuel tuning after engine mods would be nice, but i've not read enough on here to see if that is even possible.


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2008 2:04 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 24, 2008 7:47 am
Posts: 124
also for you guys heating your fuel... i've not had a metro tank apart yet, but you gotta make sure it has a 'canister' around the fuel pump that the returned fuel gets dumped into. that keeps your heated fuel from heating your whole tank.... if not you'll cook off your fuel in the tank before it ever gets to be used by your motor.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 26, 2008 6:02 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 7:41 pm
Posts: 263
Location: PA
"i'm actually going to completely block my front openings and do an air damn that draws all air from underneath. ala 3rd/4th gen f bodies and c5/c6 vettes"
Being a chevy tech; i've actually been thinking of a design for this. Even looked into 92-94 cavalier air dams. It's always nice to sit at work and stare at a vette all day :D

As for heating the fuel; i may have a design for that as well. The cup in the tank though, you mean there should be a boxed in area in the tank for a return and then holes to let it slowly bleed back into the rest of the tank?


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 04, 2008 7:38 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 24, 2008 7:47 am
Posts: 124
yep! thats what I meant by a canister... I should have said in fuel cell. but thats what the oems do.


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 07, 2008 5:59 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 7:41 pm
Posts: 263
Location: PA
Ok gotcha newby.

I've been thinking about a belly pan design, but had a question. If i place a bellypan the length of the car; would it work to cut some slits near the converter and push them upward like this:
\ \
==== ====== ====
(rough sketch!) to create a vacuum to reduce the heat build-up? OR, do you think it will be enough by putting my s-10 air dam back on and lowering it?

Another, more off-the-wall question.....will the back bumper mount up on the front of the car?! If no one knows; i'm going to try at the yard this weekend =)


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 1:03 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 24, 2008 7:47 am
Posts: 124
i would do belly pan sections and leave the primary and cat exposed... easier to deal with then. but most of the exhaust after the cat should be fine to enclose. if you really want to go all out, dont install just a smooth belly pan, dimple it (ala ford gt)

the big thing is a pan for that huge open parachute of an engine compartment we have.

i have no data on the front/back bumper thing, sorry


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PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2008 3:50 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 20, 2006 11:31 pm
Posts: 57
Location: Lummi Island
If you do an air dam and side curtains, the belly pan is not needed.
The air dam alone should be enough to negate the effects of a belly pan,
except for the area around the rear bumper. It might still benefit from
a smooth underside from the front of the rear wheels to the rear bumper.

MM
94 metro currently getting lousy mileage...


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PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2008 7:18 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 7:41 pm
Posts: 263
Location: PA
Ok, if i put the air dam back on; then i do not need a front belly pan. I will do something about the rear though. As for sideskirts, i don't know if i want to put any on my car, so i guess i would still go with a belly pan after the engine bay....? Why the dimples?

Hey gang, any idea why i can't get over 5* ignition timing on my distributor? The distributor will just not turn any farther. Remember, all stock other than the xfi cam. Any help appreciated.Just looking to maybe get a cam gear and more if i can get this figured out first.


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PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2009 12:05 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 7:41 pm
Posts: 263
Location: PA
So, I felt like reading over this all again, and wanted to touch on 2 things:
Without bringing up the flywheel issue, but doing a demo with the tires/wheels. I went from 12" steelies to 14" of the same diameter on the swift 7 spokes after having Toyota Supra rims on. The Supra rims/tires were coming in @28lbs(?), the 7 spoke/tires @25lbs, and the stockies @22-23. I have to find my exact weigh-ins again, but i think the weight of the wheels definantly did not help due to rotational mass. 1lb out there is the same as 10lbs in the car, so I'm essentially @120-160lbs too heavy. I'm running the 7spoke now to see what my mileage is. I used to be @48-52, but putting wheels/tires on and front vented rotors and rear disc has put me down @40-42 =(
The harsh line between making it look good and getting mpg! Now i cant remember what the 2nd issue was i was gonna mention....

As for flywheel, seem to be highway and stop/go, so maybe I'll still try lighter one since I do have some mountains to go over each day. Like to keep the wheels on and rear disc, etc and get back to 50mpg. I need 2 cars...1 for mpg and one for fun!


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PostPosted: Fri May 29, 2009 12:18 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 17, 2008 2:41 am
Posts: 173
Location: Canada
Is cost no object?

Because an aluminum flywheel is like $300 and that's a lot to spend to get no real result if you're driving highways all day.

Once the car is in motion and at a fixed speed, there isn't too many forces acting on it. Forget about the 10lbs = 1lb on your driveline math, that's only for accelerating. Once you get to the speed you want, it's all ALL about wind resistance as well as engine/body mechanical resistance. The flywheel doesn't resist regardless of the weight because it already has all the momentum it needs.

In fact, a heavier flywheel might actually help you pendulum from a mountain downslope up the other side, depending on your ability to pendulum etc.

_________________
"Apollo 13", 436,600km | 89 Swift GTi -dead-
91 Pontiac Firefly.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 05, 2010 1:22 am 
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Joined: Sun Sep 18, 2005 1:32 am
Posts: 254
Location: Kitchener, ON
Just wanted to say:

Heavy Engine Flywheels = Fuel Economy FTW

:-P


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