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PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2008 10:59 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2007 5:46 pm
Posts: 1099
Location: Abbotsford, BC
I noticed that the 'metrompg' guy had smooth 'moon' hubcaps or something like that. My car has been running cap-less for the longest time (because the stock ones look gay) and I want to improve my fuel economy. I've increased the psi to 35 from the door sticker 32. Do these smooth hubcaps increase the economy enough to spend $80 for four ? And can I be sure that they fit on properly with the rim.
Image
http://www.hubcapmike.com/rdc01-13.html

I think my rims are 13 inch, as they are the stock ones.

Image
http://www.jcwhitney.com/autoparts/Prod ... t=hub+caps

Not my car! (Coyote X)
Image

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1995 Firefly 1.3 SOHC 8VALVE MANUAL
2000 Firefly 1.3 SOHC 16VALVE AUTO. Goals: full restoration, achieve stock MPG and HP or higher, finished look should be 'stealthy' and unassuming. Engine will need to be rebuilt later on to restore compression levels.


Last edited by 1995Firefly4dr on Tue Feb 05, 2008 10:51 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 12:22 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 22, 2008 11:45 pm
Posts: 131
Location: Seattle, WA (Kent)
I would venture that you can increase the psi more.

Look at the side wall of the tire, don't listen to what the car says. The car was made how long ago???? Tire tech has changed. I just had the local tire place put mine at 40psi without even checking the side wall first.

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PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 12:46 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2007 5:46 pm
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Location: Abbotsford, BC
they say that the max PSI is 44 and then max recom. is 40 ? I'll update with an image of my new firestones. Partly the reason I went to 35 is because I had a hard time finding a sticky on 'tire tips' like what is the max recommended tire pressure, hub caps, etc all the info is spread out in seperate posts and it's annoying to try and find whats 'right' because everyone has a different opinion.

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1995 Firefly 1.3 SOHC 8VALVE MANUAL
2000 Firefly 1.3 SOHC 16VALVE AUTO. Goals: full restoration, achieve stock MPG and HP or higher, finished look should be 'stealthy' and unassuming. Engine will need to be rebuilt later on to restore compression levels.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 2:09 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2008 1:19 am
Posts: 36
Location: San Angelo, TX
hate to highjack from the original wheel cover topic, but since PSI/MPG was discussed, how much does it affect mpg? i bought my 95 1.0 5sp for 500 bucks a few weeks ago. First tank got 26, 2nd tank got 30, 3rd tank got 35, then 35 again. It was after this fill up i decided to look at the psi, and all the tires were at 20-25. I topped them all off at 35 and called it good. Next tank i got 30, of course i was driving a bit more aggressively on that tank, so ill see what the next tank has for me, and i guess ill have my answer, but is there a scientific percentage to how much better you get when your tires are more properly inflated?

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95 Metro 3 banger 5sp pizza delivery vehicle


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 02, 2008 9:10 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 10:11 am
Posts: 37
Location: High desert, soCal
I run mine at 40- 45 psi.

Don't panic, a lot of us do.

Is your car an automatic? If not,that's terrible mileage. If so, 35-37 or so is about average.

I increased tire pressure and installed the smoothies at basically the same time, so I can't tell you what diference they made individually. Combined they were worth about 2 mpg.

My car has 12" wheels, sits lower than yours and has the '93 body style.

Your mileage may vary.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 12:08 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2007 5:46 pm
Posts: 1099
Location: Abbotsford, BC
Here are some updates with images of my tires. I cropped the images to show the detail.
Image

Image

Image

So, if there are any tire professionals who work in a tire installer outlet, can I run at 40psi safely ? Esp. since it's winter and sometimes the roads can be slippery.

_________________
1995 Firefly 1.3 SOHC 8VALVE MANUAL
2000 Firefly 1.3 SOHC 16VALVE AUTO. Goals: full restoration, achieve stock MPG and HP or higher, finished look should be 'stealthy' and unassuming. Engine will need to be rebuilt later on to restore compression levels.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 2:52 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 10:11 am
Posts: 37
Location: High desert, soCal
I'm no tire expert.

I don't even play one on tv. But I've been running 45 psi for nearly 10,000 miles now with no ill effects. No funky tire wear, no additional interior noise or notceable ride harshness.

At a 950+ pound max. load per tire your tires theoretically could safely support a 3800 pound vehicle traveling at highway speeds.

Our cars weigh 1700 pounds, give or take. The warnings are put there for the rare geniuses foolish enough to swap them onto a 6,000 lb. '72 Eldorado.

Bead setting pressure is something entirely different. What it means is that if it takes more pressure than that to seat the bead it will result in tire damage in the bead area. It would generally indicate ill-fitting rims, or poor bead tolerances in a new tire. In other words a tire that is too small for the rim, or a rim that is too large for the tire. If you exceed 40 psi when installing the tire on the rim you need to take a look at why that is happening because you would be "stretching" the bead.

It's generally said that the tires on our cars will usually dry rot from old age long before they wear out.

I undertand your concerns on about running high pressures under icy conditions. Use common sense and adjust accordingly. This is another area where the light weight of or cars is a benefit. You can actually run far LOWER pressures than most cars in extreme conditions without tire damage.

Maybe someone who actually has tire expert cred can chime in to ease your concerns.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 9:24 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jul 19, 2007 6:02 pm
Posts: 48
Location: Hampton, VA
Hmmm....never had a tire dry rot before it wore out. Best milage I got on a set of michlins were around 81k miles. That was on my old sube and it was about 4 years worth of driving. On the metro it's working on its second set at 120k miles that I have put on.

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00 Chevy Metro 1.0 5spd


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 04, 2008 9:32 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 23, 2008 1:19 am
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Location: San Angelo, TX
22psi in town driving was 35mpg (just bought it, hadnt checked it yet)

35psi in town driving was 40mpg

aired them to 45psi before a 200mile trip and got 33mpg but that was because i was pushing 80mph against a headwind the whole way.

Took a different route and stayed between 65-70 and got 47.82mpg!!!!

Will know in a week of the 45psi gives me more noticeable mpg in town.

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95 Metro 3 banger 5sp pizza delivery vehicle


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 2:00 am 
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Joined: Thu Mar 24, 2005 1:18 pm
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Location: greenfield aka greentucky, Indiana
The do not excede 40 psi is for when seating the bead when your tires get mounted. Ignore that warning.

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The G10, Suzukis way of natural traction control.

This is my hooptie, there are many like it but this one is mine. With out my hooptie I am walking and without me my hooptie is broken down.


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 Post subject: Smooth as bottoms
PostPosted: Tue Feb 05, 2008 6:38 am 
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Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2007 4:14 pm
Posts: 556
Location: St-Ours
13 inch hubcaps are available at Go-Kat-Go at a lower price than Mikes.

I installed them on Espresso Nero. I did lose one, bought another and I'm in the process of installing them with small stainless screws.
It's a bummer when one escapes.

If you read this, you will have more knowledge about them, there is even an outfit that sells 4 for $18 albeit in 14 inch size.


http://www.gassavers.org/archive/index. ... -1539.html

Go to metrompg and ecomodder also.
Toodle-dee-doo-cracker-bits.

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Less IS more.


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 8:39 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2005 4:52 pm
Posts: 634
Location: Eastern Ontario
mustngr wrote:
I'm no tire expert.


Neither am I.

Quote:
I don't even play one on tv. But I've been running 45 psi for nearly 10,000 miles now with no ill effects.


13,500 km for me. Sidewall max pressure is 44 on my 185/80/13's. I started @ about 44, but I'm well above that now. Also no problems.

Quote:
Our cars weigh 1700 pounds, give or take. The warnings are put there for the rare geniuses foolish enough to swap them onto a 6,000 lb. '72 Eldorado.


Hilarious! :lol:

Quote:
Use common sense and adjust accordingly.


True, true. Also use caution if you ever drive on gravel roads, where very high pressure = noticeably less traction.

On the subject of $80 moon discs, unless you REALLY like the look, go for it, but don't do it for the $ savings.

I haven't tested smooth discs, but based on other mods I have tested, I'd guess they might be worth about a 1-2% increase in MPG at speeds around 55 mph, compared to bare steelies. You'd spend $4000 on gas before you saved $80 with a 2% improvement. If you're switching from regular wheel discs to smooth ones, the improvement would be substantially smaller.

Coyote X made his discs. I made mine also.

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www.MetroMPG.com ... www.ForkenSwift.com
... www.EcoModder.com


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PostPosted: Thu Feb 07, 2008 5:03 pm 
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Sad but True...

Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 8:20 pm
Posts: 2973
Location: Saskatchewan
LOL those look ridiculous

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1991 Swift GT Build G10 +25 psi + other goodies
1996 Metro Build QR25de swap, still undecided where to take it
the lolcar family


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 08, 2008 12:20 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2007 5:46 pm
Posts: 1099
Location: Abbotsford, BC
geometro wrote:
mustngr wrote:
I'm no tire expert.


Neither am I.

Quote:
I don't even play one on tv. But I've been running 45 psi for nearly 10,000 miles now with no ill effects.


13,500 km for me. Sidewall max pressure is 44 on my 185/80/13's. I started @ about 44, but I'm well above that now. Also no problems.

Quote:
Our cars weigh 1700 pounds, give or take. The warnings are put there for the rare geniuses foolish enough to swap them onto a 6,000 lb. '72 Eldorado.


Hilarious! :lol:

Quote:
Use common sense and adjust accordingly.


True, true. Also use caution if you ever drive on gravel roads, where very high pressure = noticeably less traction.

On the subject of $80 moon discs, unless you REALLY like the look, go for it, but don't do it for the $ savings.

I haven't tested smooth discs, but based on other mods I have tested, I'd guess they might be worth about a 1-2% increase in MPG at speeds around 55 mph, compared to bare steelies. You'd spend $4000 on gas before you saved $80 with a 2% improvement. If you're switching from regular wheel discs to smooth ones, the improvement would be substantially smaller.

Coyote X made his discs. I made mine also.


Okay, I'm going to try going into the 40psi zone, from 35. But I'm aprehensive because of wheather we have, one day raining the next week snow. Altough I put on snow tires when it snows. BTW, I recently put my regular tires back on from the snow tires about 7 days ago. Now, I noticed when I let go of the wheel the car will drift to the left. I also have to keep a firm hand on the wheel in order for the car to go in a straight line. Should I try swapping my front tires from each side, or bring the car into the tire shop for them to check it out (it's under warranty) .

_________________
1995 Firefly 1.3 SOHC 8VALVE MANUAL
2000 Firefly 1.3 SOHC 16VALVE AUTO. Goals: full restoration, achieve stock MPG and HP or higher, finished look should be 'stealthy' and unassuming. Engine will need to be rebuilt later on to restore compression levels.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 09, 2008 3:01 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 20, 2006 11:31 pm
Posts: 57
Location: Lummi Island
Try swapping side to side, I fought tire pull for 6 months thinking it was a front end problem. When I put the snow tires on, it went away!
I got some different front tires, took the old ones back....

MM
93 metro w/96 springs and sway bars. About to get 96 knuckles and brakes!


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 12:36 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 7:41 pm
Posts: 263
Location: PA
anyone found the 12" smoothies cheap?


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 3:52 am 
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Joined: Fri Jul 13, 2007 10:11 am
Posts: 37
Location: High desert, soCal
disrespected3cyl wrote:
anyone found the 12" smoothies cheap?


I paid around a hundred bucks for my stainless snap-ins. I called Moon and they said they could make up a set of aluminum screw-ons for slightly more than that as I recall.

13 inch and up seemed to be in the 80 dollar range, when I was looking.

I need a couple of sets of screw on aluminum 12 inchers myself if anyone has found them for less.


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PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2008 6:14 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 7:41 pm
Posts: 263
Location: PA
what about just buying a set of 13's and making them screw on. Wonder how much they would really mess with the tire being just a bit bigger...?


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:41 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2007 5:46 pm
Posts: 1099
Location: Abbotsford, BC
here's a good question I thought up. for best low rolling resistace, cheap tires, why not use four spare tires instead of regulars and test out the fuel economy ? Light weight, 60 psi, easy to get and cheap.

_________________
1995 Firefly 1.3 SOHC 8VALVE MANUAL
2000 Firefly 1.3 SOHC 16VALVE AUTO. Goals: full restoration, achieve stock MPG and HP or higher, finished look should be 'stealthy' and unassuming. Engine will need to be rebuilt later on to restore compression levels.


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PostPosted: Sat Feb 16, 2008 9:31 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 7:41 pm
Posts: 263
Location: PA
ha-i've got a very nice spare from my 91 metro if anyone is interested-FREE!! I don't think it's been used even...not 100%sure. I put a full size spare in mine to fit a sub in it and obviously have a full-size.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 14, 2008 4:54 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2008 9:14 pm
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Location: ohio
I have worn out a few tires also. I find the harder the rubber the less wear you have, and also the better the fuel mileage is. Currently I run a wide soft tire due to curvy roads. This definately hurts my fuel economy for now.

Tall tires give the best mpg, but make the figures appear worse when you use the odometer. You deffinately need to know the actual distance you have traveled for accurate mpg calculations.

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PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2008 9:09 am 
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Location: Vancouver-ish B.C. Canada
I was lucky enough to find a set of tires with a great rain tread, and they show 51 psi max. I am running 48 in them now, and it is waaaay better than the 35 I was until I saw the rating.
Much lighter steering, better cornering, and I even noticed a difference in accelleration. These little cars will show even a minor change if it is positive.

One negative is the bumps are much more noticeable, and I would think a ball joint would be easier to break if you hit a hole.


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PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2008 7:59 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 6:41 pm
Posts: 44
Location: Santa Barbara, California
I had to put my 2 cents in on this topic. I know the higher pressure is awesome for mileage and is usually no problem for the tires... BUT!!!!
Before you go using high pressures, be SURE your tires are fairly new!!!!! I got my Sprint with some older tires but they looked like they were in pretty good shape so I put around 40psi in them (max 44) for a long road trip from the San Jose, CA area up to Canada. They did fine and I averaged 48.8mpg on the trip up to Canada and back to northern Oregon where I bought a StepVan/RV and started flat towing the Sprint. I had the second best luck...Although the passenger's tire THREW THE ENTIRE TREAD, the tire didn't deflate until I just happened to stop to fuel up the Van. From the Van, I had no idea anything had happened until I got out and walked past the car and saw steel belts. As I bent down to look, it started hissing and went flat. I was really glad it had held air until I stopped, but I put the spare on and thought "Wow! Freak accident that it threw the tread!" and got back on the road 20 minutes later. About 4 days later I had gotten back to San Jose and unpacked and hooked the Sprint up to my Dodge Pickup and headed back home to Santa Barbara. About 40 miles later, I thought somebody had slammed into the back of the truck or the Sprint, but as I looked into the mirror I saw a tire tread cartwheeling down the shoulder of the road and smoke pouring out of the Sprint's wheel wells and got us off the highway IMMEDIATELY. The driver's tire had thrown the tread and as it tore away, it pulled a big hole through the belts and carcass of the tire and totally unseating the tire. It slammed the steering all the way to the driver's side and dragged both tires at full left turn until we stopped. It even bent the tow bar mounting brackets.
I'm pretty certain that if it had happened when I was driving the car, we would have rolled. Seriously scared the hell out of me.
So if you want high PSI's, be sure you have newer tires!!!!
I had gotten 2 new Kuhmos but they were on the back end (didn't trust Chinese tires....oh boy, was THAT a mistake!)
Since then I went nuts and got some 155/60/15's that fit quite nicely, can take 44 psi, and are by a good manufacturer (Continental)
Image
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85 Chevy Sprint Plus
87 Chevy Sprint Plus
It may only have 3 cylinders and be less than 1 liter.....
BUT IT'S GOT A HEMI!!
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Last edited by sbdeadelf on Sun Jul 27, 2008 8:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu May 15, 2008 11:35 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 25, 2006 12:45 am
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Location: Vancouver-ish B.C. Canada
Another caveat is, you loose contact patch with higher pressures. That's fine until the inch before you need it to be there. You also have less traction in general, especially in the rain, so be cautious.

Remember, the psi rating is for the MAX load. An unloaded tire at max psi will not have as large a contact patch. That's why I am at only 48 when the tire goes to 51psi.


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PostPosted: Fri May 16, 2008 1:50 pm 
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Sad but True...

Joined: Fri Jul 27, 2007 8:20 pm
Posts: 2973
Location: Saskatchewan
44 fronts, 48 rear... 15000km using all seasons. handles like its on rails with the suspension and the tires are pretty quiet too.

Ill run 33 or so psi at the track with the rt615's.

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1991 Swift GT Build G10 +25 psi + other goodies
1996 Metro Build QR25de swap, still undecided where to take it
the lolcar family


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