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Underbody braces, turbos and more!

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 Post subject: Carbs
PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2003 8:19 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2003 1:59 pm
Posts: 206
Location: Surrey, B.C.
I don't want to sound like I am picking on anyone, but if you go back to an old post where kris showed a carb blue print you will see I said the same thing about quad E.F.I. But I will point out that In very Hi end EfI management units they also imitate a excellerator pump. FACT when you stomp on the throttle fast you get a major drop in air pressure for a second and in turn incoming fuel goes wet (drops)and does not enter (lean) To deal with this any good system electronic or mechanical will enrich the fuel for that sort time. THis is fact. While modern stock bike carbs do not do this is because the need super smooth power delivery because when your knee is on the ground you don't want a instant tire spining surge in power. But when you are in a car you will get an extra surge in power by fuel enrichment for that brief time.As for cost I can get used sets for $500 or $600 so when I look at C.V's they really don't save me any money. You do seam to be in a differant situation. And altough I will be using smoothbores, the Holley carb sleaved to the right size and right model with some very creative tube bending and flange/base work could prove to be very effective and would also be the best route period as far as ease in tuning...... all the best ..GMC.


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 Post subject: .....
PostPosted: Thu Dec 04, 2003 9:30 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2002 5:10 pm
Posts: 1644
Location: Brisbane
Hi there.

It's a shame the net thing doesn't convey stuff as well as face-to-face. I get what you mean about fuel curves and also pressure issues. I'm also after that smooth power delivery...I have enough traction issues at the hillclimb since the cost of an LSD is somewhat prohibitive.

I'd love to have access to some overseas prices on some things...it would sure help me make my little toy even better. Must say, too, that a little mechanical four-barrel would make for an interesting sight on a GTi!!!

Just organised a brake vacuum reservoir to store a little more vacuum due to cam overlap and the shorter/lower volume runner volume.

Wouldn't mind talking to you more, if you have msn or icq or the like.

p.s. just remember my prices are in Aus$. Crappy darn currency.

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Don't ask me, I don't know anything. And just because I'm a senior member, it does not mean I have as many wrinkles as ellpee. 1500+ posts and still I haven't got a clue.


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PostPosted: Fri Dec 05, 2003 12:30 am 
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Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2003 11:18 pm
Posts: 9
Location: Honolulu, Hawaii
hi guys
did anyone here try the Keikin FCR carbs? these carbs go for like $400 up on ebay... (wow) some honda bike have them...and i got myself one too. for cheap of couse. anyway, i'm planning to drop it in on my G13 too but i'm like most guys out there not familiar with carbs...and i'm really wanted to see a step by step guide. if no body have one or have time to make one...then i will grap all the details i can and put it on a website. with pics of couse...since i'm still waiting for my fuel pump to arrive...so soon will begin.

here is some info that i found about DCOE carbs on a 4ag motor (another motor that i like besides G13) hope will help
http://www.club4ag.com/faq%20and%20tech ... 04A-GE.htm


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 Post subject: .....
PostPosted: Wed Feb 25, 2004 7:05 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2002 5:10 pm
Posts: 1644
Location: Brisbane
I've posted up some pics of the stage the car is at so far, on my personal picture album accessible from my profile. Hope to have it going soon.

You can see what I mean about limited room in my car. An old and general rule of thumb, if you are using bellmouths or ramtubes: have any opposing flat surface a minimum of 1.5 times the diameter of the bellmouth, away from the bellmouth. I.e. a 40mm bellmouth should not have a flat surface closer than 60mm to it. Using sidedrafts in my car would make it quite tricky to avoid this situation. With these carbs I can use an airbox as well...a plug is being made at the moment.

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Don't ask me, I don't know anything. And just because I'm a senior member, it does not mean I have as many wrinkles as ellpee. 1500+ posts and still I haven't got a clue.


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 Post subject: Carbs
PostPosted: Wed Feb 25, 2004 7:33 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 19, 2004 8:42 pm
Posts: 420
Location: Cattaraugus NY
On my drag bike I ran 42mm Lectrons with a flat slide and they were very compact.

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4 verts, 4 Swift Gts,3 XFIs,2 Turbo sprints,2 sprints,2001 Swift,and a few Metros 2004 tracker 1997 dodge ram4X4 1997 X-90


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 Post subject: .....
PostPosted: Wed Feb 25, 2004 10:52 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2002 5:10 pm
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Location: Brisbane
The BDSR40's are 300mm across and 90mm front to back. As a comparison, the GSXR1100 carbs I was going to use were 360mm wide and 120mm front to back. They are also old, these were off a 2000 model wreck. For easy-tune flatslides here, I was looking at between $1600 and $2200 :shock: as compared to the $400 I paid for these.

If all else fails, I do have a back-up plan. :D

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Don't ask me, I don't know anything. And just because I'm a senior member, it does not mean I have as many wrinkles as ellpee. 1500+ posts and still I haven't got a clue.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 3:48 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 19, 2002 9:58 am
Posts: 8146
Location: Seattle, WA
hey lee,
not sure where i found the previous jet kits for the yzf r-1 carbs, but here's a couple links i found on google ..
a lot of sports racer type guys are using the r-1 engine & have all sorts of tricks for drilling out & modifying the carbs.
http://www.powersportsnetwork.com/acces ... s67935.htm
http://www.yamahafz1oa.com/ivansjetkitreview.shtml
...

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'92 Swift GT, '94 Swift GT, '88 Turbo Sprint, '98 Swift ... all sold years ago


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 25, 2004 7:03 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2003 4:21 pm
Posts: 592
Location: Durham, UK
Hi N1tro,

your friends' photo of bike engine with blue inlet, is that silicon hose?
or some kind of plastic?

I am currentry making one out of standard cast manifold to take R1 carb.
It is quite involing task. Also, since I'm putting this engine into Mini it will be different set up from norm :lol: .

Do any of you know what angle actual engine sit?

Many thanks

Atchi


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 25, 2004 12:46 pm 
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Joined: Tue Nov 19, 2002 9:58 am
Posts: 8146
Location: Seattle, WA
that's wayne/poruki here on the forum, i just posted the pictures for him, never went through w/ my own carb project ..

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'92 Swift GT, '94 Swift GT, '88 Turbo Sprint, '98 Swift ... all sold years ago


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 25, 2004 2:58 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 22, 2003 7:13 am
Posts: 22
Location: Vancouver, CANADA
The engine sits at 15 deg. angle.
Yes, that is blue silicone hose. :lol:


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Mar 25, 2004 5:07 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2003 4:21 pm
Posts: 592
Location: Durham, UK
Thanks,

I thought it may be.

I have been cutting up standard cast Aluminum and hoping to get them weld it up.
Did any of you know there is a difference between mk1 and mk2 inlet manifold.
As far as I can see, there is a vacume take off for mk1 on left hand side (ftom front of the car) and both of them has exhust dark spot on right hand side.I think this is from ex gas.
Do you know what they do?
I mean this ex gas.

Thanks for the help anyway.


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 Post subject: .....
PostPosted: Thu Mar 25, 2004 8:33 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2002 5:10 pm
Posts: 1644
Location: Brisbane
If you need to know about vacuum lines on a Mk1, I have a vacuum map posted in my personal album that should help.

Mk1 inlet manifold = crap skinny, twisted runners and tiny plenum with little 40mm TB
Mk2 inlet manifold = better runners, bigger plenum and 45mm TB

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Don't ask me, I don't know anything. And just because I'm a senior member, it does not mean I have as many wrinkles as ellpee. 1500+ posts and still I haven't got a clue.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 26, 2004 4:49 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2003 4:21 pm
Posts: 592
Location: Durham, UK
Thanks Oz,

This vacuume diagram looks good but I'm not sure :oops: .
I think it is fitted to no. 12.
I will send you a photo.

cheers
Atchi


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Mar 26, 2004 5:08 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2003 4:21 pm
Posts: 592
Location: Durham, UK
Hi Oz,
I got a wrong end of stick here.
I went to see my friend in engineering shop.
He point me out that head I got and inlet manifold I got is not from same era. Also, it wasn't vacuume, it was water... :oops: Doh!!
I think I got a solution for this R1 bike carb inlet now.
He told me it looks like you can actually weld in Ali tube and forget about inlet manifold. R1 carb looks like it need to sit at 75 degree and engine sit at 15 degree forward. This will make inlet angle of 120 degrees.
He thinks he can do it and I have high faith with him been glass track winner's engine builder and all that.
Also, He tried this with Suzuki bike engine and told me it works well.
So, he got my cylinder head and R1 carb to play with.

Cheers for your info.
Atchi


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 Post subject: .....
PostPosted: Fri Mar 26, 2004 10:57 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2002 5:10 pm
Posts: 1644
Location: Brisbane
My setup is so close to being finished now it is not funny. I'll be certain to post results when done.

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Don't ask me, I don't know anything. And just because I'm a senior member, it does not mean I have as many wrinkles as ellpee. 1500+ posts and still I haven't got a clue.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2004 5:06 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 28, 2003 4:21 pm
Posts: 592
Location: Durham, UK
Hi,

End result will be nice to see.
My head is passed on but my friend will take a long time to do job but when he finished, it will be a paka!!
He did tell me something else that R1 carb is not equally spaced.
So, he will make spacer and all of things to make them aline carb with inlet. This will be interesting.

He also told me putting too much angle to inlet manifold is not good for power. He told me, his customer had down draught carb and 90 degree bend on weber and ford enigine.
If you put side draught with straight inlet mani, it produced 30BHP more :shock: than it this with 90 degrees.
He did this on rolloing road so it must be right.

When I get this head back, I will take photo and try to posted for everyone to see.

Cheers for now

Atchi


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 Post subject: .....
PostPosted: Sat Mar 27, 2004 7:29 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2002 5:10 pm
Posts: 1644
Location: Brisbane
Yes, sidedraft is ultimately better....although 30hp on the Suzuki engines would be questionable....

I can't fit sidedrafts into my Mk1 without firewall modification.

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Don't ask me, I don't know anything. And just because I'm a senior member, it does not mean I have as many wrinkles as ellpee. 1500+ posts and still I haven't got a clue.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 28, 2004 4:13 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2003 1:59 pm
Posts: 206
Location: Surrey, B.C.
Neither style makes more or less HP, it's that they must have a compatible style of intake track to match the carbs. On our motors a side draft is the best style and will be worth 3 to 4 horse more then a down draft. When OzMidnight builds his next car he will take out the heater and make a air box into the fire wall, or at least that is what I said he should do, and by the way those little now unused injector holes do make a dandy wet NOS direct port injection system, should you every once in a while need to get rid of a pesky 5.0 mustang.


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 Post subject: .....
PostPosted: Sun Mar 28, 2004 9:00 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2002 5:10 pm
Posts: 1644
Location: Brisbane
Hehehehe...actually I was thinking they'd possibly be used again if I ever fitted up some bike TB's.

Although if this last round of changes don't give me the end result I am chasing, I will likely sell the whole car and buy something better. NOS would be handy, shame the hillclimb scruntineers and the police don't agree so much.

GMC, talked the the guy we were corresponding about....I'd say slackness is involved, I'm sorry to say!

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Don't ask me, I don't know anything. And just because I'm a senior member, it does not mean I have as many wrinkles as ellpee. 1500+ posts and still I haven't got a clue.


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 Post subject: .....
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2004 2:46 am 
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Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2002 5:10 pm
Posts: 1644
Location: Brisbane
Hi guys,

A quick update....turned my car over for the first time today, with the carbs on. Just an idle test and pressure test to check for leaks. No leaks and a rock-steady 1100rpm idle. More to come, hopefully.

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Don't ask me, I don't know anything. And just because I'm a senior member, it does not mean I have as many wrinkles as ellpee. 1500+ posts and still I haven't got a clue.


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 Post subject: .
PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 4:51 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2002 5:10 pm
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Location: Brisbane
The car was driven yesterday...under light acceleration it was happy to run to 70kmh - the speed limit on the road I was on. Enough to get me to the tuners. :) Just got to try and score some of his time, now.

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Don't ask me, I don't know anything. And just because I'm a senior member, it does not mean I have as many wrinkles as ellpee. 1500+ posts and still I haven't got a clue.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2004 9:15 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2004 9:45 pm
Posts: 102
Location: Seattle,Wa, U.S.A
Oz: congrats! nice to hear ya got it going!!

I just picked up my new set of R1's, so the devolepment begins! be nice to see how they work on the 3 and 4 cylinders.

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'90 Geo "Retro"- 3x Mikuni Carb 1.0
Custom ground performance Cam
Custom advanced timing cam gear
MSD 6al control, coil, wires.
2" exhaust from the hollow cat back
Short throw shift
front & rear strut bars
lowered 1.5"


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 Post subject: .....
PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2004 9:42 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2002 5:10 pm
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Location: Brisbane
The car is 95% tuned now.....right up to about 5500rpm. Before the tuner takes it to the higher limits, I have to change/alter a few things just to help stuff along. Up until that point, the car runs very well, and actually achieved 14.7:1 on cruise. Quite decent off the line and with regards to throttle response - although I may go one richer on the needle settings. Driveability is great, with the car happy to tool along at 60kmh in 5th gear, even with the cams I run, which are something similar to BD14's.

Once I tidy up the few things he noted, it will go back for a few final fiddles and then a power run. Pretty happy with it already...sounds very nice on the intake side, even with the airbox. The exhaust note has changed to sound like a slightly milder version of something like a 70's/80's rally car.

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Don't ask me, I don't know anything. And just because I'm a senior member, it does not mean I have as many wrinkles as ellpee. 1500+ posts and still I haven't got a clue.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri May 07, 2004 10:10 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2004 9:45 pm
Posts: 102
Location: Seattle,Wa, U.S.A
Oz:Which jets/needles are you currently running? Just out of curiousity.

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'90 Geo "Retro"- 3x Mikuni Carb 1.0
Custom ground performance Cam
Custom advanced timing cam gear
MSD 6al control, coil, wires.
2" exhaust from the hollow cat back
Short throw shift
front & rear strut bars
lowered 1.5"


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 Post subject: .....
PostPosted: Sat May 08, 2004 7:18 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 23, 2002 5:10 pm
Posts: 1644
Location: Brisbane
Stock carb needles but mains are at...150...I think, right now. We'll see if that changes any with more work. Needles are on highest groove. Might drop this to second groove as yet. The air correction jets may also be removed and new ones made - once more dyno time is done.

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Don't ask me, I don't know anything. And just because I'm a senior member, it does not mean I have as many wrinkles as ellpee. 1500+ posts and still I haven't got a clue.


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