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 Post subject: 4.39 transmission tlc
PostPosted: Mon Oct 01, 2012 8:02 am 
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have a 4.39 tranny and it clicks going into second from third, so would just second need to be changed, is that an option even ?

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89 Swift gti
Modified B16 P29 75mm pistons,13:1CR, cultus intake, genie header, genie exhaust, 3tech head, 3tech 222/365 cams, 3tech UD pulley, megasquirt 2.0, 60mm throttle body, Aluminum flywheel


Last edited by beached on Thu Feb 28, 2013 10:20 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 9:22 pm 
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Location: castlerock Wa,
does it click or grind?

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 10:05 pm 
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clicks apparently,
i dont really know,
guy who had the car before said it clicks going into second and for it to not click you had to match the revs.

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89 Swift gti
Modified B16 P29 75mm pistons,13:1CR, cultus intake, genie header, genie exhaust, 3tech head, 3tech 222/365 cams, 3tech UD pulley, megasquirt 2.0, 60mm throttle body, Aluminum flywheel


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 03, 2012 10:23 pm 
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Bad synchro.

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 4:42 pm 
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what's involved in getting synchos fixed? id like to use this transmission

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89 Swift gti
Modified B16 P29 75mm pistons,13:1CR, cultus intake, genie header, genie exhaust, 3tech head, 3tech 222/365 cams, 3tech UD pulley, megasquirt 2.0, 60mm throttle body, Aluminum flywheel


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PostPosted: Sun Oct 07, 2012 10:34 pm 
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Click... probably more like a small 'crunch' at this stage, rebuild it now before it gets worse, otherwise you'll end up replacing the low speed hub as well which is at least a few hundred bucks.
Requires a full rebuild, how many miles?


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PostPosted: Tue Feb 26, 2013 8:51 pm 
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Location: Hamilton, Canada
So i am rebuilding this transmission,
which of these kits would work best,

http://www.ebay.ca/sch/i.html?_sacat=0& ... ild&_sop=3

No kits come with gears?

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89 Swift gti
Modified B16 P29 75mm pistons,13:1CR, cultus intake, genie header, genie exhaust, 3tech head, 3tech 222/365 cams, 3tech UD pulley, megasquirt 2.0, 60mm throttle body, Aluminum flywheel


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 5:03 am 
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The kits say from 87 but it's actually from 89 onwards, 5 synchro's is a bit of an overkill, never seen a damaged 4th gear syncro, 3rd and 5th gear sometimes, 1st and 2nd always.
Check the engagement teeth on both 1st and 2nd gear as well as the ones on the inside of the sliding part of the hub.

Mulletman can probably enlighten us on the kits from the geo metro owners perspective


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PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:10 pm 
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Replacing just second gear synchro is an option and will take care of the issue. Replace first as well. I've done a ton of them, replacing just seals and those two synchros. The 4.39 boxes rarely have bearing failure issues(98+ 3.79 boxes seemed to). When you get the trans apart, you will find that there are 3 slots on one side of the brass synchro, and there will be very noticeable elongation wear on them. The issue you are seeing is quickly followed by the next symptom which is nearly impossible downshift into second gear once the slots wear a tiny bit more.
There is of course nothing wrong with doing the whole rebuild kit, never hurts to do more, but you will have success just doing the second and first synchro.

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1995 Swift w/16V 4.39s, 3tech cam, Esteem t-body, Header, needs more.
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 5:23 pm 
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I started tearing the tranny apart today, I'm somewhat stuck.
Not too sure what I have done, or what to do next.

If I screw it up I at least have a buyer for the ring and pinion, so I'm just trying to learn at this point.
If I can pull this off I'll be really happy.

On the last picture, I don't know how to get the nut off the end of the counter shaft because the whole assembly spins, and I can't figure a way to hold while trying to loosen it.


Attachments:
File comment: There is wear on this gear, not sure if that's the culprit to the grinding into second problem beyond synchros?
gear wear.jpg
gear wear.jpg [ 77.21 KIB | Viewed 2315 times ]
File comment: Once I opened it there were 2 bearings loose, and I don't know where they came from, I'll find out I guess.
Mystery bearing.jpg
Mystery bearing.jpg [ 105.29 KIB | Viewed 2315 times ]
tranny1.jpg
tranny1.jpg [ 113.7 KIB | Viewed 2315 times ]
File comment: These 2 pictures are as far as I got and could use some advice from here on out.
tranny2.jpg
tranny2.jpg [ 193.63 KIB | Viewed 2315 times ]

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89 Swift gti
Modified B16 P29 75mm pistons,13:1CR, cultus intake, genie header, genie exhaust, 3tech head, 3tech 222/365 cams, 3tech UD pulley, megasquirt 2.0, 60mm throttle body, Aluminum flywheel
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 5:32 pm 
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Location: Alberta, Canada
The gear you are concerned about is reverse. No issue there, you are ok. The little ball you found is a detent ball. There are 3 of them. You actually took the trans apart backwards from normal procedure, making it a bit more confusing for you as a first timer, but it won't be a big deal. Ideally you set trans down with eng side down and lift off the housing that you have left with the gears in it.
From the point you are at, you need to remove the 26mm(I think?) nut retaining 5th gear on, then the flat plate held down with about 6 screws. Your 5th gear you show looks to be in good shape, that's good news.
Study the tear down diagram that is on here, it's a bit hard to explain the procedure from here. You are doing fine so far though!

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1995 Swift w/16V 4.39s, 3tech cam, Esteem t-body, Header, needs more.
1995 Gt Mustang "Boss Shinoda" package.
1999 F150 4x4 Supercharged
1967 Mustang 428 auto, never ending expensive project
1993 Civic si h22a, fell in my lap, couldn't resist!


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2013 5:48 pm 
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viewtopic.php?f=9&t=42589


...Wow, I feel very in over my head.
And since I've done it ass backwards too

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89 Swift gti
Modified B16 P29 75mm pistons,13:1CR, cultus intake, genie header, genie exhaust, 3tech head, 3tech 222/365 cams, 3tech UD pulley, megasquirt 2.0, 60mm throttle body, Aluminum flywheel


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2013 2:11 am 
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No panic, put the bellhousing part of the case back on with 3 or 4 bolts, flip it up the other way and put the 3 detent balls and springs back in, longer spring in the middle, leaving these detent balls in is the key to making sure all the gears are in the bottom bellhousing part of the case when you split the case.
Attachment:
Mar19 005s.jpg
Mar19 005s.jpg [ 164.3 KIB | Viewed 2298 times ]


Once you have the case back together, reinstall the shift rod and yoke, you need to be able to put it in gear and then manually engage 5th gear as well, once it's in 2 gears the shafts are locked and you can undo the 26mm nut with a breaker bar.


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PostPosted: Fri Mar 29, 2013 3:48 pm 
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So I gave up on the transmission today.
I had put it back together to tear back apart the correct way, but some unfortunate things happened and that was that.


That being said....I don't see any substantial wear on the gears or synchros that would create the grinding of 2nd as aforementioned.

It was a good learning experience, maybe if there's a next time I could successfully work on one.
Using the 4.10 will be fine, it keeps the revs low for highway travelling so I will appreciate that.


Attachments:
20130329_133838.jpeg
20130329_133838.jpeg [ 59.34 KIB | Viewed 2244 times ]
20130329_133815.jpeg
20130329_133815.jpeg [ 170.13 KIB | Viewed 2244 times ]
20130329_133830.jpeg
20130329_133830.jpeg [ 91.4 KIB | Viewed 2244 times ]

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89 Swift gti
Modified B16 P29 75mm pistons,13:1CR, cultus intake, genie header, genie exhaust, 3tech head, 3tech 222/365 cams, 3tech UD pulley, megasquirt 2.0, 60mm throttle body, Aluminum flywheel
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 29, 2013 10:14 pm 
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Location: Alberta, Canada
You can't see the slots that wear until you disassemble that shaft. Shame to give up at this point, 10mins with a press and you would find the issue, and be ready to put it back together. The 4.10 gears aren't my favorite in the mk4's, did a couple and always found they had a hard time at highway speed in 5th, even with strong engine. Worked well in town though.

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1995 Swift w/16V 4.39s, 3tech cam, Esteem t-body, Header, needs more.
1995 Gt Mustang "Boss Shinoda" package.
1999 F150 4x4 Supercharged
1967 Mustang 428 auto, never ending expensive project
1993 Civic si h22a, fell in my lap, couldn't resist!


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