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 Post subject: USA made LSD
PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2015 5:50 pm 
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Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2006 10:43 pm
Posts: 720
Location: Texas 75150
Anyone have one of these installed?
How does it work?
Is it holding up?

http://www.ebay.com/itm/261769163717?_t ... EBIDX%3AIT

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Fainya
97 Geo Metro LSI,1.3L-GT-DOHC-16v,4.10 5-speed,A/C,170,000,suspension lowered 1",4 wheel disk brakes,15"alloy wheels with 185/50-15 Toyo's,GT bucket seats,analog oil pressure gauge,cruise control, new paint job. 40 mpg at 65 mph.
Good, fast, cheap. You only get two.


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 Post subject: Re: USA made LSD
PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2015 6:52 am 
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Joined: Sun Dec 05, 2010 5:56 pm
Posts: 1035
Location: Wahiawa, HI
To be honest I'm surprised you'd ask.

I apologize for being that guy who talks out his ass about a product he has never installed, but who buys and compares more than one LSD? That's crazy time and $$. When I was looking for a solution I did do some research on this style however.

This looks to be similar to a "Phantom Grip" style LSD that inserts spring loaded plates between the spider gears so that they have some friction when they are not turning together. I would expect that this does have some positive effects, but that it would not be better than the "poor man's lsd" solution that you are already using. Grassroots Motorsports apparently did a comparison of various LSD possibilities and summed it up this way:

Quote:
These are okay for drag racing and can be made to work reasonably well for front-wheel drive racing on ovals, but the preload, small friction areas and locking would seem to be drawbacks for high-power front-drive autocross or road course use." and go on to say "If you do use one of these, it would make sense to have the case, pinions and side gears hardened and to periodically examine the fluid and debris pickup magnets for excessive material.


I would see the constant friction aspect as a problem too, i.e. if you have enough friction to lock up the wheels well when there is a large torque differential, then you will have too much for the gears to freewheel like they should when you are cornering and not spinning a wheel.

Here are some relevant threads from those who have installed similar diffs in other cars:

http://www.northamericanmotoring.com/forums/drivetrain-cooper-s/18897-is-the-phantom-grip-lsd-for-real.html

http://grassrootsmotorsports.com/forum/grm/thoughts-on-the-phantom-grip/15896/page1/

For anything but rally racing where you would need to put power down even with one wheel in the air, I think a Quaife-style diff is your best bet. I run Balli's and his works well and is quite reasonably priced--I'd buy one again even though I had some minor fitment issues:

http://teamswift.net/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=52040&p=425606

Though I suspect they work pretty much the same, I have a tip that it is also possible to spend a bit more and get a genuine Quaife unit if you are willing to wait for it and commit to getting on the phone with them in Australia :wink: The genuine Quaife unit I've seen looks like it's designed to be a few grams lighter, though I would imagine it would work more or less the same.

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 Post subject: Re: USA made LSD
PostPosted: Sat May 30, 2015 6:28 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jan 29, 2014 1:18 am
Posts: 212
Location: Slovenia
i use balli's helical diff too.. we tried it in rally (with protlum suspension tuned for tarmac with lots of holes, corner cutting and 5-20% gravel) it's OK but plated style is much better..

for road use helical is much better.. car is everyday use driveable even without power steering.. (any plated style is not driveable for everyday without power steering)

about that "phantom grip" thing.. i think it's about same as really cheap (performance wise) plated style lsd...


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 Post subject: Re: USA made LSD
PostPosted: Sat Jun 06, 2015 4:00 am 
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Joined: Tue Oct 03, 2006 10:43 pm
Posts: 720
Location: Texas 75150
I am thinking about reengineering what I am doing with the PMLSD.
I would like it to last longer and be stronger. I am aware of the
road wondering you get with the plate type of LSD. If setup is to tight
the car wants to wander down the road. If to loose you don't get
the traction to both front wheels. There is such a fine line between
the two that reengineering the setup would help make it better.
More to follow as I rework the problem.

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Fainya
97 Geo Metro LSI,1.3L-GT-DOHC-16v,4.10 5-speed,A/C,170,000,suspension lowered 1",4 wheel disk brakes,15"alloy wheels with 185/50-15 Toyo's,GT bucket seats,analog oil pressure gauge,cruise control, new paint job. 40 mpg at 65 mph.
Good, fast, cheap. You only get two.


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 Post subject: Re: USA made LSD
PostPosted: Sat Jun 06, 2015 5:43 am 
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Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2010 9:16 am
Posts: 412
Location: sidney, nebraska
If i remember correctly, Auburn Gear has a magnetic locker. It uses a magnetic clutch to lock the diff solid. It can be on, off, or auto engaged. auto mode ties into the TPS and monitors throttle sweep rate and into wheel speed sensors. If they have one to fit these little trannies that would be fun.

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 Post subject: Re: USA made LSD
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2015 7:51 am 
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Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2012 8:59 am
Posts: 6
Location: Dubbo NSW
Teeth wrote:

Though I suspect they work pretty much the same, I have a tip that it is also possible to spend a bit more and get a genuine Quaife unit if you are willing to wait for it and commit to getting on the phone with them in Australia :wink: The genuine Quaife unit I've seen looks like it's designed to be a few grams lighter, though I would imagine it would work more or less the same.


G'day

I googled to find a suitable Quaife unit and could not find any mention of Suzuki.
Any suggestions where to look?


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 Post subject: Re: USA made LSD
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2015 10:29 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 14, 2005 10:19 am
Posts: 361
Location: Canberra, Australlia
oldvanman wrote:
Teeth wrote:

Though I suspect they work pretty much the same, I have a tip that it is also possible to spend a bit more and get a genuine Quaife unit if you are willing to wait for it and commit to getting on the phone with them in Australia :wink: The genuine Quaife unit I've seen looks like it's designed to be a few grams lighter, though I would imagine it would work more or less the same.


G'day

I googled to find a suitable Quaife unit and could not find any mention of Suzuki.
Any suggestions where to look?


Helical/Torsen LSD in Oz. Best option is Modena Engineering. Got to be lucky though as they seem to make in batches of 10 and therefore can be a wait between runs. They are a great unit. I have used one before and would highly recommend. Looking at about AUD1300.

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 Post subject: Re: USA made LSD
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2015 4:47 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jun 16, 2012 8:59 am
Posts: 6
Location: Dubbo NSW
FlyingGrape wrote:
oldvanman wrote:
Teeth wrote:
Helical/Torsen LSD in Oz. Best option is Modena Engineering. Got to be lucky though as they seem to make in batches of 10 and therefore can be a wait between runs. They are a great unit. I have used one before and would highly recommend. Looking at about AUD1300.



G'day

Thanks for that. I have found their website...
http://www.modenaengineering.com.au/
and sent in an enquiry.

Thanks


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 Post subject: Re: USA made LSD
PostPosted: Thu Jun 25, 2015 11:00 am 
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Joined: Wed Jan 29, 2014 1:18 am
Posts: 212
Location: Slovenia
guy named "bali" from hungary make copy of quaife torsen/helical lsd.. i use it and it works well.. i can't compare it to original quaife or modena as i didn't see/use them.. but it's cheap, around 600-650eur in EU..


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