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 Post subject: interchange question
PostPosted: Fri Jun 20, 2003 5:56 pm 
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Location: philly
can u interchange the swift 89 instrument cluster the one with the tach with the chevy sprint 88 cluster that doesn't have the tach.<br>i really want tio use the swift one in the sprint but afraid it might burn the curcuits <p></p><i></i>


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 Post subject: Re: interchange question
PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2003 3:32 am 
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you will likely have to manufacture a custom adaper to connect the Sprint's harness to the Swift instruments (that's so all the lights and indicators work) I don't think you'll run into a problem of burning anything out, most of the electricals are 12 volt bulbs that won't care about polarity. I think the Swift cluster uses the speedo cable to send the ECU wheel speed info, but don't quote me on it. I'm also not certain if the speedo cable rotates at the same speed for both vehicle, so there's a chance the wrong speed and distance will be displayed (both speedos , if I remember read from 0-140, but again this may vary by locality) I myself own an 88 Sprint and my speedo goes from 0-140 KPH in a 180 degree needle sweep, and think the last '89 Swift speedo I saw also did 0-140, but in a needle sweep well over 180 degrees. But here's your big problem: the tach. The Swift tach will assume you have a 4 cylinder engine connected to it, the stock engine in your Sprint is a 3 cylinder. So even with everything connected your engine will be reving 1.3 times faster than your tach will show. Chances are you can solder a resistor somewhere on the tach to change the rate the needle moves(this is what I've seen other people mention on the internet about doing engine swaps in vehicles that involve moving up to more cylinders). I've considered a very similar tach install into my Sprint, but I was thinking of using an aftermarket tach set to 6 cylinder mode, then modifying it to double it's needle sweep. Your best bet (and my own), would be to try and locate an instrument cluster out of a 5 speed Forsa that has a tach (a tach also calibrated for a 3 cyl engine) <p></p><i></i>


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 Post subject: Re: interchange question
PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2003 12:35 pm 
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I think the rpm are measured by a crank sensor, so the number of cylinders has nothing to do with the tach. If the single transducers are the same in both engines, then the tach should function normally.<br><br>Aftermarket tachs rely on an inductive signal from the coil, in which case this problem would occur (provide there was no way to "tell" the tach how many cylinders there were). But I'm pretty sure OEM tachs don't share this problem. <p></p><i></i>


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 Post subject: interchange
PostPosted: Tue Jun 24, 2003 5:21 pm 
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I confrim what lithon say. If you want accurate tach reading you'll have to install a resistor or your needle will alway show eroneous RPM. There is no crank sensor on suzuki engines, the only way the ECU can keep track of the engine's rpm is by counting the number of pulse coming from the distributor. <p></p><i></i>


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 Post subject: Re: interchange
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2003 4:55 am 
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ok, then. There you have it.<br><br>But if thats the case, a resistor will not help. The ECM is receiving an inductive signal of pulses, and it is "counting" the pulses. The only way to "reduce" the signal is then through a complex circuit. Simply adding a resistor will only reduce the signal strength. <p></p><i></i>


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Mar 07, 2004 2:11 pm 
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What should be determined here is if the ECU counts all cylinder firings or just #1 to provide a signal to the tach. If it just counts #1 then it won't matter how many cylinders the engine has. If it counts all cylinders then the tach will not read accurately when swapping in engines with a different number of cylinders.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 4:36 pm 
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Any tacho I have encoutered counts ALL pulses. The aftermarket tacho's have a switch to go from four cylinder to six to eight (no good for my rotary at the time!) So, I expect that any replacement non standard tacho would have to be from a vehicle with the same number of cylinders. And yes, if you know someone in the electronics engineering trade, the circuit to convert pulses is quite stragihtforward, but you need to know what you are doing. imho installing a resistor will only lower the signal and perhaps slightly smoothen out the pulse, but we all no that that really needs a capacitor eh...

jimsxray wrote:
What should be determined here is if the ECU counts all cylinder firings or just #1 to provide a signal to the tach. If it just counts #1 then it won't matter how many cylinders the engine has. If it counts all cylinders then the tach will not read accurately when swapping in engines with a different number of cylinders.

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 Post subject: .....
PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 7:39 pm 
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Your Mk1 speedos, and later speedos only go to 140kmh? Even the Jap ones go to their limit of 180kmh. My speedo goes to 220kmh....or was it 210...whichever, it'll not see that speed anyway.

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 Post subject: Re: .....
PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 7:41 pm 
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OzMidnight wrote:
Your Mk1 speedos, and later speedos only go to 140kmh? Even the Jap ones go to their limit of 180kmh. My speedo goes to 220kmh....or was it 210...whichever, it'll not see that speed anyway.


Lee 230:)

I'll have to draw it up to approx 280 when limiter will be set to 8500 or so :P

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 7:56 pm 
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Location: saskatoon
What about a Geo MEtro cluster? I bought one off ebay and am waiting for it to come for my Sprint. Is it plug and play? It has a tach and mine dosent.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 8:53 pm 
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use a turbo firefly cluster with a tach. plug and play. just the turbo light doesn't light up! :) and you get white #'s and red needles vs Green #'s and orange needles

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Mar 08, 2004 11:13 pm 
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Theres only like 10 turbo cars in my whole province :( Dose the metro work? its still a 3 cyl cluster isent it? The boost gauge will come later :D

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2004 12:04 am 
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I'm pretty sure there is a CAS (crank angle sensor). I remember seeing it mentioned in the service manual somewhere. I also have a friend who swapped the whole instrument cluster (speedo, tach, fuel, water temp) from a Metro GSi (92-94 SOHC 4 cylinder quasi-GTi variant in Canada) into his plain 92 Metro 3 cyl and it worked just fine. No hassles whatsoever. The cars were from the same "generation" though so they had the same wiring harnesses.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Tue Mar 09, 2004 8:42 am 
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Quote:
I'm pretty sure there is a CAS (crank angle sensor).


Its in the distributor.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2004 2:27 am 
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Just posting a update for those interested. I got my Metro gauges finally and it was plug and play. Unplugged my Sprints and plugged in the metros and everythings working fine :) My car had no tach and the Metro one dose. I am very happy :D It also has a upshift light woo ho

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Wed May 05, 2004 4:14 pm 
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On this same subject, I found a 93 or 94 3 cylinder Metro in a junk yard today that has a tach in it's instrument cluster. If I were to swap it out into my 96 3 cylinder Metro, would everything still work correctly including the tach? thanx.............

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